TTN3 Traffic feature, how does it connect?

[DavidW]

Some networks around the world do charge for GPRS connect time - but in the UK all networks charge only by the data transferred, which is the sum of bytes sent and received.

GPRS can be charged like this because the phone isn't constantly tying up a valuable radio resources (like a traffic channel, used to carry a voice, data or fax call) when in a GPRS session.


If you want the technical term, GPRS is packet switched instead of circuit switched. If you think of the way your data travels over the Internet, where you're connected to a nearby piece of the Internet (your ISP) and each 'chunk' of data is switched by the routers at your ISP and beyond to get to the correct destination that's packet switching. Circuit switching is like a phone call - though it doesn't actually work this way, it's like a pair of wires connected straight from your phone to the phone at the other end.


A further advantage is that GPRS data is potentially faster than making a GSM data call.



David

[Lost1]

lbendlin,

Thanks, that's cleared away a lot of confusion.

So as long as the phone Co. charge per packet of info is OK it seems like it's a relatively inexpensive service. (or am I missing something else)

[Carll]

Went into my local orange shop yesterday, asked the chap there about BT phones. I had a Nokia, and he said only one BT connection at a time. OK, so which phones can have more than one, his reply was non are available at present that can carry more than one similtainious BT connection.
_________________
iPAQ 5550; 400MHZ - 256 SD Card - TT wired GPS - TTN3 UK - PPC 2003

[radavis]

I have read all of the above comments with interest, but I still havent seen anything that actually explains how the information from a GPRS phone is transferred to my IPAQ. I havent got BT, and I have seen nothing from TOM TOM that says you need a BT Pocket PC and/or BT phone. All it says is a GPRS connection is needed.

I would suggest that the majority of users do not have BT phones and a BT Pocket PCs.

All the best

Raymond

[MrT]

TomTom is correct in that if a user wants the traffic feature they need internet access to their PDA and as they are on the move, this is going to need to be GPRS.

Users can connect their iPAQ to GPRS anyway they want, cable to the phone, infra-red to the phone, bluetooth to the phone or better still they can have the phone built into their PDA such as the XDA or forthcoming iPAQ 6300.

At the end of the day its down to the user to find a way to get mobile internet access on their PDA and a lot of older technology may not be up to it. I would expect that the majority of phones with mobile internet access (not WAP) will have have bluetooth.

[DavidW]

I'm with MrT - users should be able to work out whether or not they can get Internet connectivity with their Pocket PC before purchase.


IrDA (infra-red) is probably impractical in car.

Most phones don't accept cable connections to access modem functions. Those that do tend to need special cables that contain interface hardware powered from otherwise unused pins on the serial port. These cables can fail to work on non-PC hardware such as embedded systems and PDAs.

This leaves Bluetooth as the most likely option, along with phone hardware built in to the Pocket PC.


Using Bluetooth tends to require that you're not using the phone's Bluetooth connectivity for hands-free (either a Bluetooth headset or Bluetooth car kit). Most phones don't support both a headset or handsfree Bluetooth profile connection and a dial-up Bluetooth profile connection simultaneously. My Nokia 6310i certainly doesn't; fortunately my car kit is the excellent wired one. This problem is not limited to Nokia, though - do test that you can access the Internet from your Pocket PC in car before paying any money for TomTom Traffic (when it launches).

The same restriction doesn't extend to Pocket PCs - most if not all Pocket PCs are quite happy with simultaneous Bluetooth operation on different profiles. There should be no problem with a serial port Bluetooth profile connection to a Bluetooth GPS, and a dial-up Bluetooth profile connection to a GSM/GPRS phone.


TomTom merely suggest GPRS - if you have another way of getting Internet connectivity to your Pocket PC, I can't see any problem in using it, but anything where the charges are based on connect time (such as making a data call on GSM) is likely to prove prohibitively expensive. WAP only or WAP/MMS only GPRS service is almost certain to be useless for TomTom Traffic.

You can check out your setup by trying to browse the web using Pocket Internet Explorer. The 'low graphics' version of BBC News Online works particularly well on a Pocket PC, especially if you can cope with the text size set to 'smallest'.



David

[Lost1]

Hi,

Does any one know how GPRS is charged when travelling abroad. I will be going through France to Spain in a few months and wonder if the cost of GPRS will be as bad as when I use my mobile to make a call from abroad or because its transmitted over the "World Wide Web" is there only 1 charge for wherever you are located

I am still unsure if the traffic feature is worth the costs involved especially with all the reports of duff information about hold ups and the loss of other TomTom features
_________________
iPAQ 1940, Pocket PC2003, BT TTN5

[MrT]

Whilst you will not be able to determine the real breakdown of charges, it will not be the access to the web that costs more when abroad, but the use of the mobile operators network to access it.

The high cost of mobiles when using other operators networks exists due to the extra "admin" that needs to be done for each call such as verifying with the users home operator that they have sufficient credit to make the call, then billing the home operator. No doubt hefty profits are added as well.

However at the end of the day it is down to the contract you hold with your own operator and the agreements they have reached with their counterparts in other countries. You need to check with your operator what they will charge you on your contract.

As to the costs of the traffic feature, it is free at the moment but will cost around £50 (I bet the price will not be fixed at the current rate) per year per country (?). Also the traffic feature abroad will only work with fully licenced maps for that country, not the major roads of Europe.

The quality of the traffic application and the data are not good at the moment. I am also trialling the PPC2003 PDA (not the XDA) version of Traffic-I and the data on that is far more timely and accurate than when TomTom traffic is working. On the downside it is not integrated with the Navigation program, but then again I only want TomTom to warn me of problems on my route, not to decide to re-route itself. With Traffic-I costing £40pa + GPRS, I am almost certainly going to subscribe to this service as well when my trials finish. You can run Traffic-i and TomTom traffic at the same time without any interference.

The key to making TomTom traffic work with the current version is to use small regional maps as this means it only downloads small (regional) amounts of traffic data which seems to stop all the issues that you see reported here.

[DavidW]

GPRS roaming is usually hideously expensive - 10 pounds per megabyte is not uncommon. There's no real reason for it to be this price, but this is the price charged.


For comments on the quality of the data, see this post. Traffic-i uses Trafficmaster data, which I regard as the best traffic data there is, but the indication is that Trafficmaster will not licence this data for satellite navigation systems.


The price has been press released as 50 Euros (less a few cents) for a year, or 10 Euros (less a few cents) for a month - which is somewhat less than 50 pounds. You need to add your GPRS charges on top. You do get a three month free trial at the moment.



David

[Lost1]

Me again !

Sorry if I am not up to speed on this yet but do check out my original post and you will understand why

I have my iPAQ sitting in it's cradle and although it's set up to work with the mouse on BT, the mouse is usually connected to the iPAQ cradle via it's cable so that everything is permanently on charge (it tends to be in use for hours at a time). I have also got an expansion card in the SD slot. My phone is capable of GPRS but is not BT. However, it does have an infrared window (in & out I presume) my iPAQ has an infrared window (in & out I presume).

1. Can I use BT and IR at the same time to connect to 2 different devices

2. Why is IR impracticable in a car

3. Will the traffic updates be based on the map that is in use or the route that has been requested

Any help will be gratefully accepted and know doubt lead to more questions
_________________
iPAQ 1940, Pocket PC2003, BT TTN5

[DavidW]

Infra-red is impractical in car because you need to keep the two devices lined up (infra-red is line of sight). You can have a Bluetooth connection to a GPS and an infra-red connection to a phone if you can keep the phone and Pocket PC lined up.

The traffic system downloads all traffic incidents for the entire map loaded - though this is typically no more than about 8KBytes per update for the entire Great_Britain map.



David

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