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Joined: 20/08/2002 11:51:57 Posts: 3859 Location: Essex, UK
Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2004 11:53 am Post subject:
The way TomTom create their maps means that it is not just a small area that changes with a release of new maps the entire map data changes. This means that the full file needs to be downloaded. _________________ Mike Barrett
Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 9:17 pm Post subject: Antiques road show.
Sorry to drag this topic into the foreground again for you forum regulars, but having only just purchased TomTom Nav 3, and living by Jct. 9 M42, I'm a bit peeved and have just sent TomTom a little email (CCd below, FYI).
Reading through the M6 Toll threads, it seems that (and please correct me if I'm wrong) they do not regularly update their maps and when they do, it'll be v4 and I'll probably have to pay for an upgrade!
I will be putting on my consumer hat and fighting tooth and nail for a free upgrade if this is the case.
Anyhow, here is the email I have just fired off:
I purchased my TomTom system and have been impressed but for a number of major map errors or omissions.
For example, the M6 Toll - Britains most major roadway for decades - simply doesn't exist. Not only that, but thanks to the surrounding road changes, for large sections of the M42, especially around J9, my GPS reliably informs me I'm in the middle of a field, and at one point, navigating a canal. It is so out of date that on a journey last week the software became so confused it navigated me onto the M6 Toll causing the short remainder of my journey (of under two miles) to become a 15 minute, 8 mile round trip on the Toll road trying to find an exit, which then cost me £2.
I am pleased with the navigation side of the software, which is very user-friendly, but please can you tell me when the map data will be updated?
The M6 Toll and surrounding roads have been completed and open since December 2003 - 9 months ago.
I would expect updates more regularly than this, otherwise the system is effectively redundant and I might just as well go back to a paper atlas.
Over the next few months I have many long journeys to make and I would like some assurance that TomTom have a commitment to their customers to keep their map data current.
I look forward to your response soon.
Thanks and regards,
S. Britton.
From what I gather on here, I am expecting a typical automated Dear Customer email in response. If I get anything more exciting I'll let you know.
Joined: Mar 18, 2004 Posts: 753 Location: Biggleswade, BEDS
Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 10:48 pm Post subject:
This thread may help, in a nut shell TomTom have the data they are not prepared to give TT V3 UK users access, even those people willing to pay a further admin charge.
Joined: 24/06/2003 00:22:12 Posts: 2946 Location: Escaped to the Antipodies! 36.83°S 174.75°E
Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 12:39 am Post subject:
MikeB wrote:
The way TomTom create their maps means that it is not just a small area that changes with a release of new maps the entire map data changes. This means that the full file needs to be downloaded.
Tom Tom invented their map format, so they could format them in such a way that they could provide small, downloadable patches to update the maps when changes are made. Regardless of what the geodata providers say, 99% of the mapping data doesn't change from one year to the next.
I think the reason they don't provide updates is more to do with the licence agreement with TeleAtlas than any technical issues with creating map updates.
We are at the stage now where GPS Street Mapping programs are pretty much feature complete. There isn't much more that we really need. What people will be looking in the future is more up-to-date maps and this will end up making or breaking a product. What do you want most, a whizzy 3D map display or a GPS with accurate, up-to-date maps?
The only way things will change is if the street mapping companies get bombarded with demands for upgrades to the latest maps at a reasonable price. As the GPS street mapping software market matures, upgrades like this will be offered.
Joined: Jul 10, 2004 Posts: 296 Location: In the Office
Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 6:50 am Post subject: Is It or Ain't It
doctorwhen wrote:
Anyhow, here is the email I have just fired off:
[i]I purchased my TomTom system and have been impressed but for a number of major map errors or omissions.
For example, the M6 Toll - Britains most major roadway for decades - simply doesn't exist. Not only that, but thanks to the surrounding road changes, for large sections of the M42, especially around J9, my GPS reliably informs me I'm in the middle of a field, and at one point, navigating a canal. It is so out of date that on a journey last week the software became so confused it navigated me onto the M6 Toll causing the short remainder of my journey (of under two miles) to become a 15 minute, 8 mile round trip on the Toll road trying to find an exit, which then cost me £2.
.
A little contradictory,
First you say the M6 Toll doesn't exist on your GPS,
Then you say it "Navigated you" ONTO the M6 Toll.
How can it navigate you onto something that Don't Exist
Joined: 20/08/2002 11:51:57 Posts: 3859 Location: Essex, UK
Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 7:34 am Post subject:
Skippy wrote:
Tom Tom invented their map format, so they could format them in such a way that they could provide small, downloadable patches to update the maps when changes are made. Regardless of what the geodata providers say, 99% of the mapping data doesn't change from one year to the next.
Where did you get that information from?
According to TomTom they designed their map data to be as compact as possible.
When I talked to the technical people at TomTom they told me: The data is created from a number of nodes each having links to other nodes. These nodes are allocated unique identifiers. When they get new mapping data they have to completely rebuild the database so the node identifiers are not the same. Therefore they cannot patch a small area of a map. _________________ Mike Barrett
Joined: 20/08/2002 11:51:57 Posts: 3859 Location: Essex, UK
Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 7:37 am Post subject: Re: Is It or Ain't It
delboy0754 wrote:
Then you say it "Navigated you" ONTO the M6 Toll.
How can it navigate you onto something that Don't Exist
You have obviously never driven the M6 around the new toll road then.
All the junction layouts have changed, making it easy to be given the wrong info. It happened to me when I was going to the NEC, but I was able to stay on the road I wanted thhough. _________________ Mike Barrett
Joined: Jul 10, 2004 Posts: 296 Location: In the Office
Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 12:49 pm Post subject: Re: Is It or Ain't It
MikeB wrote:
delboy0754 wrote:
Then you say it "Navigated you" ONTO the M6 Toll.
How can it navigate you onto something that Don't Exist
You have obviously never driven the M6 around the new toll road then.
All the junction layouts have changed, making it easy to be given the wrong info. It happened to me when I was going to the NEC, but I was able to stay on the road I wanted thhough.
MikeB,
i was refering to doctorwhen's email to TomTom
quote,
purchased my TomTom system and have been impressed but for a number of major map errors or omissions.
For example, the M6 Toll - Britains most major roadway for decades - simply doesn't exist. Not only that, but thanks to the surrounding road changes, for large sections of the M42, especially around J9, my GPS reliably informs me I'm in the middle of a field, and at one point, navigating a canal. It is so out of date that on a journey last week the software became so confused it navigated me onto the M6 Toll causing the short remainder of my journey (of under two miles) to become a 15 minute, 8 mile round trip on the Toll road trying to find an exit, which then cost me £2.
unquote,
If the GPS he was using didn't have M6 Toll on it, how could he be navigated onto the M6 Toll by the GPS.???He states the maps are out of date, and the M6 Toll doesn't exist, it's either on the software or it isn't.
Joined: Apr 11, 2004 Posts: 140 Location: Mid-Northumberland, UK
Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 1:02 pm Post subject:
As I recall from driving around there before it opened - they've remodelled parts of the M6 & M42, and those remodelled parts have become M6Toll - so previously existing tarmac now has a new number - so it appears on the map - even though the map is out of date and doesn't have the M6Toll on it....
I live in Tamworth (M42 J10) and commute from Solihull (M42 J5), so pass through the M6 junctions each day without actually going on to the road.
If you were to follow TT3, apart from the aquatic-expedition experienced by the guy above, you do get led onto the M6toll at J9.
What is equally annoying is the surrounding supply roads which are just messed up!
I'm also unsure of how much of the traffic info is reliable when going through this tarmac-void!
With Co-pilot Version 5 coming out soon (apparently today), no one in their right mind is going to by Tomtom now unless the maps are updated. I can appreciate factors such as the user interface etc., but at the end of the day if the underlying data is wrong, no matter how nice the front end is, the result will always be messed up.
Bottom line, Tomtom - you'll lose all future customers who go near the M6 toll, unless you update your maps or release a new version (which you'd better not, unless I get it for free....I have had TT3 for 2 months) _________________ IPAQ 2210 Rom 1.00 CF 512MB
TT3 / TTBT & Fortuna Clip-On
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