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EricWB Frequent Visitor
Joined: Jan 31, 2007 Posts: 310
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Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 4:15 pm Post subject: Defraggler |
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I still have windows XP on my PC and use some free to use software called CCleaner that helps to clear away unwanted files, e.g. temporary Internet files, logs from things like AVG and other software that just keeps adding new data to old.
The last time I downloaded an update to this I made a voluntary contribution so didn't feel guilty about also downloading something called Defraggler, an improved form or defragging software, that certainly improves the performance of the PC.
After backing up my TT devices I have used it to dfrag them, only time will tell if they run better they seem to but then it could just be my imagination. Have others done anything similar? |
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dhn Frequent Visitor
Joined: Oct 08, 2007 Posts: 2544 Location: Toronto CANADA
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Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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Defragging a flash drive as in the tt unit is not the same as defragging a physical hard drive on your computer. Or, in other words, there is no value to defragging the gps internal.
As least, that is my understanding...... _________________ David |
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PaulB2005 Pocket GPS Moderator
Joined: Jan 04, 2006 Posts: 9323 Location: Durham, UK
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Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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There is no benefit and it fact it'll shorten the life of your flash device.
Flash devices do not suffer with fragmented data as it takes the same amount of time to read information wherever it is on the drive. Unlike a "normal" drive where the read / write head (like the arm on a record player) has to move and there can be a slight delay in retrieving data whilst the head is moving.
Secondly flash drives purposely distribute data all over the drive to maximise the life span of the drive ("wear levelling"). Defragging upsets this scheme and increases the number of writes each sector goes through, thereby decreasing the life of the drive.
In short do NOT defrag any flash or solid state drive. |
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AndyVaughan Lifetime Member
Joined: Apr 13, 2006 Posts: 1500 Location: Rossendale
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Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 6:46 pm Post subject: |
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Don't quote me on this, but the read/write cycles on flash memory is significanty more than it used to be.
Doing a full Windows Explorer backup, formatting the flash and then reloading the backup has the same effect as defragging.
I too reckon it runs more smoothly after doing this, but it is probably all perceived as opposed to reality! |
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EricWB Frequent Visitor
Joined: Jan 31, 2007 Posts: 310
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Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 7:41 pm Post subject: |
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I have to admit I had never thought a flash drive could wear out as it were, I had always assumed they just lasted forever. But they must last longer than a hard drive surely? So I doubt the occasional defrag would make any difference to the perceived life as something else on the TT device will fail long before the flash drive. |
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young-goat Lifetime Member
Joined: Jun 27, 2006 Posts: 160 Location: London, UK
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Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 10:32 pm Post subject: |
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Before you use CCleaner (or any clean up utility) on a Windows computer make sure you untick or exclude .chk files or it will delete those from your TT backups as it sees them as unneccessary.
TT is based on Linux and uses .chk files for things that Windows doesn't |
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EricWB Frequent Visitor
Joined: Jan 31, 2007 Posts: 310
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Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 11:16 pm Post subject: |
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I never said that I used CCleaner for the TT but some other software from the same software source called Defraggler.
If you do use CCleaner on anything you have to have a reasonable working knowledge about the files it may delete if you just let it go without regards to the end result.
And of course for safety always ensure you have a backup of anything on any device either PC or TT before you do anything that may change any of the data in any way. |
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andy-c1 Lifetime Member
Joined: Feb 05, 2005 Posts: 1039 Location: East Sussex
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Posted: Sat Apr 24, 2010 8:29 am Post subject: |
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shies there is some invaluable info in this thread ,have learnt something this morning already
thanks _________________ TomTom 5001 |
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PaulB2005 Pocket GPS Moderator
Joined: Jan 04, 2006 Posts: 9323 Location: Durham, UK
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Posted: Sat Apr 24, 2010 10:25 am Post subject: |
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Quote: | Don't quote me on this, but the read/write cycles on flash memory
is significantly more than it used to be. |
True. Newer models are coming out with MTTF (Mean Time To Failure) times in the millions of writes. However modern disk based drives have a MTTF time of thousands of hours. However the 3 i replaced in PCs this week all had an "up time" of under 1000 hours. In one case it was under 200 hours.
Quote: | Doing a full Windows Explorer backup, formatting the flash and then reloading the backup has the same effect as defragging. |
Not quite. Defragging will involve lots of little writes all over the drive moving small chunks of data about. Some sectors could be written to several times in the process. It's like putting a jigsaw puzzle together. You shuffle the bits around and around until you complete the picture using some bits of the table over and over.
Compare the thrashing sounds from the drive made during defragmentation to that when restoring data to a blank drive.
Quote: | I too reckon it runs more smoothly after doing this, but it is probably all perceived as opposed to reality! |
It is perception rather than reality. It is for this reason that manufacturers of Solid State Drives include in the instructions to disable tasks under Windows such as SuperFetch, Prefetch and Defragmentation as they have no effect of performance. On a disk based drive there is a delay as the read / write head has to physically move over the disk to relevant section of the disk and wait for the disk to rotate to the point it can read the data, then if the file is fragmented it has to move about picking up sections of the file. The location of the file on the drive can also affect access times. Files closer to the centre of the disk are read quicker than those on the outside. With flash / solid state drive there are no physical moving parts and it takes the same amount of time to read data from anywhere on the disk regardless of it's location.
Last edited by PaulB2005 on Sat Apr 24, 2010 10:34 am; edited 2 times in total |
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PaulB2005 Pocket GPS Moderator
Joined: Jan 04, 2006 Posts: 9323 Location: Durham, UK
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Posted: Sat Apr 24, 2010 10:27 am Post subject: |
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Quote: | I never said that I used CCleaner for the TT |
If you read young-goats post again you'll see he is referring to running CC on your COMPUTER after you have taken a backup of your TT. CC May decide to delete the CHK files that will be in your backup that are important to the operation of your TT. If CC is allowed to remove them and you then decide to wipe the TT and reinstall the backup you may find the backup missing some vital files.....
Last edited by PaulB2005 on Sat Apr 24, 2010 10:33 am; edited 1 time in total |
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young-goat Lifetime Member
Joined: Jun 27, 2006 Posts: 160 Location: London, UK
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Posted: Sat Apr 24, 2010 10:31 am Post subject: |
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EricWB wrote: | I never said that I used CCleaner for the TT but some other software from the same software source called Defraggler.
If you do use CCleaner on anything you have to have a reasonable working knowledge about the files it may delete if you just let it go without regards to the end result.
And of course for safety always ensure you have a backup of anything on any device either PC or TT before you do anything that may change any of the data in any way. |
Oh dear !
Having a hiissy fit are you ?
That was just general advice to anyone reading this that they should make sure that when using any clean-up utility they should make sure it does not delete .chk files ! |
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