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Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 4:06 pm Post subject: Strange Trip-Log Start/Stop behaviour.
According to the v1.4 User Guide (p13) "Using the Start/Stop button allows you to pause data logging during a journey eg. pausing for a lunch break."
Is it just me , or does anyone else think that the Trip Log behaviour is illogical during time periods when it is 'Stopped'?
Unless my Active10+ is faulty (v.14 (09.02.21) the following Trip Log data values get updated during this period:-
Total Dist, Str Line Dist, Ave Moving, Ave Speed, Max Speed, Elevation, as well as Max, Min & Asc.
whilst the following data values do NOT change:-
Total Time, Time Moving
Given the stated purpose of the Start/Stop function, I would have thought it more sensible to either:-
a) Not change any values
or
b) Only change the Total Time value.
The inclusion in the Trip Log of Sunrise & Sunset times also seems curious - since these are position dependant, whereas the Trip Data is more generally a summary of the journey to date. I would find it more useful if these fields where replaced with Stoppped Time and % Route Done.
It is also apparent that the All_RAW_tracks.gpx file continues to be updated throughout the Stopped period - although the manual states (p13 last para):- "When Stop has been pressed, the unit stops all data logging.
Please can anybody explain the rationale for this behaviour?
Thanks, _________________ Chris
Can't comment on your first observations as I haven't been that observant , but does seem odd.
Quote:
It is also apparent that the All_RAW_tracks.gpx file continues to be updated throughout the Stopped period -
This has been observed in the past(distance accrued after 'reset' and before 'start' is recorded), but the converted trail and internal GPX after conversion should be correct.
I've not had an opportunity to test this in the field yet, but I think that on occasions like stopping for lunch etc, the hibernate function is better suited.
Joined: Nov 29, 2009 Posts: 27 Location: Yorkshire
Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 7:25 pm Post subject:
4ndynorfolk wrote:
I've not had an opportunity to test this in the field yet, but I think that on occasions like stopping for lunch etc, the hibernate function is better suited.
I must check the trip logging next time I'm out, but agree that the hibernate function could be a way round it. And, thinking off the top of my head, if you do not have the hibernate upgrade yet, could you.... Stop the trip log, then turn off the unit while you have lunch, afterwhich turn on the unit, wait for a lock and then reStart the trip log? This could save an hour's power whilst in the pub, or have I got it wrong
I must check the trip logging next time I'm out, but agree that the hibernate function could be a way round it. And, thinking off the top of my head, if you do not have the hibernate upgrade yet, could you.... Stop the trip log, then turn off the unit while you have lunch, afterwhich turn on the unit, wait for a lock and then reStart the trip log? This could save an hour's power whilst in the pub, or have I got it wrong
I guess these are possibilities - but if this is the solution it begs the question as to what is the intended use of the Stop/Start function?
And of course, the original point about which Trip Log data values do & don't get updated remains. _________________ Chris
Joined: Mar 21, 2007 Posts: 261 Location: Cambridgeshire, UK
Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 9:46 pm Post subject:
Gwyver wrote:
I guess these are possibilities - but if this is the solution it begs the question as to what is the intended use of the Stop/Start function?
The Active 10 was not designed for the All_RAW_tracks.gpx file to be used in the way that some people now use it: the "official" way to get track data off the unit and into your PC (and soon Mac) is to convert the trail to a track : if you do this, then the Start and Stop points in the log file *are* honoured properly in the resulting .gpx file.
I actually prefer to convert trails to tracks now that the latest version of firmware gives each file a meaningful name in the form of the date and start time of the track. It also gives more options than earlier versions for those who want to convert but not delete (i.e. record cumulative logs over several days).
... the "official" way to get track data off the unit and into your PC (and soon Mac) is to convert the trail to a track : if you do this, then the Start and Stop points in the log file *are* honoured properly in the resulting .gpx file.
Having just gone
lucevans wrote:
the "official" way
and converted yesterday's walk trail to a track, I'm unclear as to what you mean by
Quote:
*are* honoured properly
as, on inspection, the resulting .gpx file still does not contain /trkseg & trkseg marks at the points where the Active 10 Trip Log was Stopped & Restarted. Also, as previously mentioned, the log records from the period in which the Log was Stopped remain in the converted Track .gpx file. _________________ Chris
Gwyver,
I think you may have a problem on your unit. I haven't checked thoroughly but while most boxes on the Trip Log do update while 'Stop' is selected, total distance does not on my machine.
The only file that honours Start/Stop pauses is the exported .MAP file. It will not show the actual pauses as it is a route file, though it does contain track data in the 'Desc' tags.
I see your point on track segments, you might like to suggest it as a future change. In Satmap's favour it must be said that (a) these files were originally for internal use and (b) while a standard GPX would be very nice, I have yet to find one - everyone goes their own way and pays the standard only lip service. Personally I prefer the files as they are - they are simpler to process.
Gwyver,
I think you may have a problem on your unit. I haven't checked thoroughly but while most boxes on the Trip Log do update while 'Stop' is selected, total distance does not on my machine.
The only file that honours Start/Stop pauses is the exported .MAP file. It will not show the actual pauses as it is a route file, though it does contain track data in the 'Desc' tags.
I see your point on track segments, you might like to suggest it as a future change. In Satmap's favour it must be said that (a) these files were originally for internal use and (b) while a standard GPX would be very nice, I have yet to find one - everyone goes their own way and pays the standard only lip service. Personally I prefer the files as they are - they are simpler to process.
CORRECTION: It is possible to export as a track file. While Satsync is open go into 'Settings', select the export tab and tick the required option in 'Export my .MAP routes as'.
The only file that honours Start/Stop pauses is the exported .MAP file. It will not show the actual pauses as it is a route file, though it does contain track data in the 'Desc' tags.
.....
CORRECTION: It is possible to export as a track file. While Satsync is open go into 'Settings', select the export tab and tick the required option in 'Export my .MAP routes as'.
Thanks for this. However, the .MAP version won't do what I need. According to a SatMap rep I've spoken to, this file only contains a maximum of 500 'trackpoints' - in order to create a small file size. These points are selected from the actual track data based on their deviatiion in bearing from earlier points.
Like an increasing number of photographers, I use GPS track data for Geotagging photos. (This involves the use of a program such as Geosetter to examine a folder of digital images and automatically match the timestamp data on each image with the corresponding point in the track file. The relevant Long, Lat, Elevation & (in some cases nearest placename data) is then written back into the image's EXIF data.) The converted .MAP file lacks sufficient trackpoints to do this task accurately. _________________ Chris
Have you tried the Geo-tag Photos option in Satsync? I haven't tried it yet, but I assume it uses the internal file to get time comparisons. These should still be at about 1 second intervals.
Have you tried the Geo-tag Photos option in Satsync? I haven't tried it yet, but I assume it uses the internal file to get time comparisons. These should still be at about 1 second intervals.
Not yet, because:-
a) I'm comfortable with my existing photo-processing workflow, and don't want to risk changing too many variables at once.
b) I suspect that the SatSync GeoTag app may only be able to process JPEGs, whereas I take photos in the camera's RAW file format.
c) The SatSync GeoTag user guide indicates that to use the app places additional restrictions on how & when you Start, Stop & Reset the Active10 Trip data.
I'll give it a try at a future date when I've taken some photos as an experiment. _________________ Chris
Joined: Mar 21, 2007 Posts: 261 Location: Cambridgeshire, UK
Posted: Mon Dec 21, 2009 4:28 pm Post subject:
Gwyver, which geotagging software do you use? I'm using Geotagalog for Mac and it successfully uses the .gpx file created when I convert track-to-trail to tag both RAW and JPEG (Canon). To keeping a record of my routes for mapping purposes, I also convert the .map files on export and use those as map overlays. I must confess, like you, I have an established geotagging workflow that works well for me, so I haven't tried the SatSync geotag function (which would require a lot of faffing around transferring files between Mac and PC for me).
Gwyver, which geotagging software do you use? I'm using Geotagalog for Mac and it successfully uses the .gpx file created when I convert track-to-trail to tag both RAW and JPEG (Canon). To keeping a record of my routes for mapping purposes, I also convert the .map files on export and use those as map overlays. I must confess, like you, I have an established geotagging workflow that works well for me, so I haven't tried the SatSync geotag function (which would require a lot of faffing around transferring files between Mac and PC for me).
I use GeoSetter (see http://www.geosetter.de/en/index.html) - which is freeware for Windows PCs and is really versatile. As well as handling JPEGs, TIFFs and the usual stuff it works with most varieties of camera RAW files as well as Photoshop formats & XMP sidecars (handy for use with Adobe LightRoom). You can also create KMZ files which open in GoogleEarth to display your track with your photos positioned on the relevant location.
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, but does seem odd.
