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Posted: Fri May 19, 2006 5:17 pm Post subject: GPSmap 60CSx map hell
Dear friends,
a couple of weeks ago I bought a GPSmap 60CSx to replace my faithful GPSmap 60C. I have also bought a SandDisk Ultra II microSD 1.0GB card to replace the base 64MB card.
Installation was quite simple - then I built a 850MB series of maps using City Navigator Europe v8 through MapSource 6.10.2. However, after about 30 minutes the software began sending data through USB, but a warning message appeared saying "Lost connection with the unit - check the cable". Of course the cable was OK, but the GPS unit was stuck with the screen message "receiving data". I had to switch it off and on again, and restart the computer, starting again to build map data, this time with a reduced set (about 450MB) of maps. Before MapSource started to build Map data, this time a different warning message appeared "GPS does not have the memory needed to archive maps - verify if the memory card is correctly placed". I checked the memory card - and placed it on a card reader connected to a couple of computers, but I found it is unreadable both by Windows XP SP2 and Mac OSX 10.4.6.
So, I returned the memory card, asking for a replacement, supposing it was a faulty card. Today the replacement arrived, I followed the same steps explained before with a 750MB sets of maps data, and the very same problem appeared! Now I've got another unreadable 1GB memory card - and its problem is clearly caused by a giant bug in the Garmin software.
Of course I sent a message to Garmin's Customer Support, but after two weeks I didn't get any reply. And I have also sent a message to SanDisk's Support - they suggested to try a software called "SwissKnife". It does recognize the card correctly, but it can't format it.
Does anybody have a suggestion on how I can "revive" - and ultimately use - that card with my GPSmap 60CSx?
Now I've got another unreadable 1GB memory card - and its problem is clearly caused by a giant bug in the Garmin software.
What do you mean? Can't you delete using the card reader or format?
The process you are trying to do should not involve the unit until you have used the PC with MapSource to choose the Maptiles, built the Index files, transferred the MapFile by USB 2 to card reader, and only then should the card be placed in the Unit!
The card reader would show nothing more that a mapfile of xxxMB, nothing to view!
When you try it out for the first time you should attempt it with a few Maptiles. Expecting the unit to cope with 850MB of Maps is too much, perhaps!!
I would not load more than you need as the unit will be searching through so much!
What do you mean? Can't you delete using the card reader or format?
Probably you haven't thoroughly read my message, where I wrote: "I checked the memory card - and placed it on a card reader connected to a couple of computers, but I found it is unreadable both by Windows XP SP2 and Mac OSX 10.4.6." I thought it was clear that I can't format an unreadable card.
strumble wrote:
The process you are trying to do should not involve the unit until you have used the PC with MapSource to choose the Maptiles, built the Index files, transferred the MapFile by USB 2 to card reader, and only then should the card be placed in the Unit!
Well, this is simply not true - just go to page 9 of GPSmap 60CSx manual - it clearly says that you have to install a MicroSD card into the GPS unit in order to transfer the map data. There is no mention in the Garmin manual to use an external card reader even if - how I discovered later - this is allowed.
Just for the record, this are the other procedure I (unsuccessfuly) tested:
I put the card into a USB card reader - trying to format it through WinXP. But when I right-click on the card reader's icon, the hourglass appears for 30 seconds and then the cursor reappears, without showing any pop-up menu. So, I can't format the card with WinXP. I updated the card reader's firmware and its driver. No way to format the card.
Somewhere on the net I read about an "universal" card formatter, made by HP. It is called "USB Disk Storage Format Tool v2.0.6". It correctly recognizes the card reader and the MicroSD capacity (969 MB). Apparently it does start the formatting process - using FAT - but at the end a warning appears: "Failed to format the device".
Then I tried a software called "Partition Manager Pro v7.0.0.1274". But even if it recognized the card as "unformatted", it failed to create a single FAT partition on it.
I also have tried to connect the card reader with the MicroSD card to a Power Macintosh G5 - and tried to format the card using Apple's Disk Utility, selecting the "MS-DOS File System". The software just waited endlessly to finish partitioning the card.
The process you are trying to do should not involve the unit until you have used the PC with MapSource to choose the Maptiles, build the Index files, transferred the MapFile by USB 2 to card reader, and only then should the card be placed in the Unit!
The process you were trying and I was commenting on was to load 850MB! This is best done as I suggested. After all your quotation sums it up:-
Quote:
Before MapSource started to build Map data, this time a different warning message appeared "GPS does not have the memory needed to archive maps
I quite agree that Garmin's method is suitable for smaller cards or smaller transfers. Did Garmin ever intend that such big mapsets and cards should be used?
On a general note:-
Other forums found it to be so slow using the units for transfer rather than the card readers!
It was also found to slow the 're-draw' of the maps in the unit when you use such big mapsets, and as a result we [including me] rarely put more than 500MB of maps into 1GB cards.
There have been some updates to the 60CSx software available on the Garmin website which may be of interest.
On the Garmin website 'Owner's Manual' - Page 8 - it clearly suggests the use of the card reader.
Probably they have changed it - because this is what is written at page 8 of the manual that was included with the unit I bought: Map data transfer requires the USB Interface Cable provided with the unit to transfer MapSource data from a PC to the MicroSD card in the GPSMAP 60CSx Inserting the MicroSD card in a standard SD card adapter and card reader allows for transfer transfer. In my opinion, that clearly means that the basic map data transfer MUST be done with the card in the GPS unit. And - as an option - you can speed up the process if you have a card reader at hand.
strumble wrote:
Interesting to note that the largest card in the 60CSx accessories listing, is a 256MB.
Yes. It is also interesting that on the same page 8 of the manual, it says You can purchase additional higher capacity MicroSD card at your electronics supplier. It clearly means there are no limits on the capacity of MicroSD cards to be used on the GPS, otherwise (I believe) Garmin should have printed in bold letters Do not use cards larger than 256 MB.
Still fighting to "resurrect" the card - even tried to format it in Linux, but I got lost with the code...
Use administrative tools in the control panel to delete the partition of the memory card, then create a new partition and format it.
Tried that - it does see the card as an "unallocated" partition. But when I try to partition it, a warning message appears saying "Unexpected error - close the disk management tool and restart it".
Posted: Sat May 20, 2006 12:05 pm Post subject: WARNING: GPSMap 60CSx bug confimed!
oddsock wrote:
You may find this interesting
Thanks Dave, this is the "official" confirmation that the new Garmin GPSMap 60CSx definitely have problems.
To learn more about the serious problem, you may have a look at these links (translated from German)
Under what version(s) of the firmware has this problem been identified?
The first thing I did with my newly purchased 60CSx this week was to update the firmware. Perhaps rather rashly, I chose to use the 2.71 beta release, but have had no cause to regret this - it works fine. In particular, I have downloaded over 100MB of maps to a standard Sandisk 1GB Micro SD card via the GPS, and experienced no problems.
OK, it's only the standard card, although it is 1GB, and yes, it's a smaller download, but it's just a bit of further evidence.
If the 60CSx has a performance problem over handling a very large map set, that's a design error over the way the storage is used, not an inherent problem with large storage devices, or at least not until you cross the 2GB threshold into FAT32 territory, which I assume the Garmin can't handle. My camera throws large numbers of 10MB image files at its 2GB CF card and finds its way around them without the slightest problem.
Writing a large mapset from Mapsource to card via the unit, rather than via a card reader, may be inefficient, but that should be no more than a trial of the user's patience, not an occasion for system failure, still less an excuse for the card being permanently munged.
Posted the below a couple of days ago in alt.satellite.gps.garmin ("1 GB MicroSD Ultra II RIP?"), look familiar?
"Just received a 1GB Sandisk MicroSD Ultra II yesterday for my GPSMAP
60Csx - and as of today it does not work!!
I transfered 955MB from Topo GB to the card via a card reader and it
worked perfectly. Then tried to transfer POIs directly to the card in
my 60Csx and suddenly......nothing happened.
That 'nothing' now means that the card is not recognised by the GPS or
my card reader....it is dead (cue dead parrot sketch).
I've contacted Garmin for some help. Frankly it doesn't look good. The
original 64MB card still works fine and all software is current.
This is the second card to go to cyberheaven. The first one did the
same thing, thought it was a one off problem with the card.
Any help, suggestions or sympathy would be greatly accepted."
There seems to be a pattern here.
Info I have so far is that the standard 1Gb cards work fine with card reader or GPS (confirming whats in this post). I have had no probs with my standard 512Mb card.
Either Garmin or SanDisk have screwed these cards, 'taint us. I've contacted both with no reply.
Any ideas how we get one of them:
a) to respond
b) to accept that there is a problem
c) that it is not our fault
d) that it is their fault
e) to fix, repair, replace our dead cards
I'll try to get a replacement (for my second card) from the supplier. However, don't hold too much hope.
Is the card 'fit for purpose' - Yes :D
Is it 'fit for purpose' in a CSx - No
According to my personal experience and from various sources on the net, it is confirmed there is a serious software bug that renders unredable those cards under these conditions:
Using MicroSD cards larger than 512MB
Transferring the map data to the card while it is placed inside the GPS unit
Transferring map data larger tham 128MB.
Avoiding these llimitations seem a safe measure to use the card on the latest Garmin GPS units - at least until a software update will address the problem.
In the meantime, I tried my THIRD SanDisk Ultra II 1GB card - I attached it to the computer through an external reader, and I sent to it only about 300 MB of data. It works, but of course that means that I'm wasting 70% of its capacity.
According to my personal experience and from various sources on the net, it is confirmed there is a serious software bug that renders unredable those cards under these conditions:
a. Using MicroSD cards larger than 512MB
No personal experience here yet (I'm getting a 1 Gb non-Ultra replacement). Reports suggest 1 Gb non-Ultras work OK
b. Transferring the map data to the card while it is placed inside the GPS unit
I had no problems transferring data to any from my 512Mb in GPS or in Card Reader. No personal experience with 1 Gb standard cards. Though writing to the 60CSx with the Ultra II inside has screwed two cards!!
c. Transferring map data larger tham 128MB
Have transferrred upto 500Mb to 512Mb card and successfully transferred 940Mb (via card reader) to the 1 Gb Ultra II card. No success when writing any data directly to the 60CSx with an Ultra II card.
I believe that:
a. You can read and write to standard 1Gb cards using GPS or Card reader.
b. You can read and write to a 1Gb Ultra II card ONLY through a card reader AND there may be an upper limit to the amount of memory used (suspect near to 999Mb??!!).
However, this is all supposition!! Lets lay my cards on the table.
I am not going to experiment with the Ultra II cards to find out the problem/bug. That frankly is for Garmin and Sandisk to sort out. I cannot afford to up cards - they should!
Either SanDisk or (probably) Garmin should fully test the 1 Gb cards (including the Ultra II) and let us the consumer know what will and what won't work in the Garmin 'x' models.
Frankly the response from SanDisk and Garmin has so far been lacking. SanDisk "does Garhup (sic) support 1Gb cards?" and Garmin......nothing.
As is often the case when dealing with large corporations, it is difficult to get a resolution to difficult problems.
But hey we are only the customers who spent £350 - 450 on a 60CSx and £30 - 45 on one, two or three dead Ultra II microSds.
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up cards - they should!
