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Posted: Wed Jul 21, 2010 9:37 pm Post subject: Cameras and Switzerland
Hi, I am traveling down to Italy this summer, and will be driving through Switzerland. I know that it is illegal to have Swiss cameras on the Tomtom, (hence their absence from the PocketGPS Europe files), but is it ok to drive through Switzerland with the UK, French and Italian cameras showing ?
Joined: Feb 01, 2006 Posts: 2543 Location: Rainham, Kent. England.
Posted: Wed Jul 21, 2010 11:51 pm Post subject:
To be safe, looking at the last three lines in the following, I would have a second SD Card without any cameras and change it when entering and leaving Switzerland. Better still 'Avoid Switzerland'.
From 2007.
Quote:
Sure, Switzerland is all like "that's cool, bring your embezzled funds and criminal self on over, we don't mind," but when it comes to personal navigation devices, they take a bit harder line. On January 10th a law went into effect banning the use of a navigation device to warn of speed surveillance locations, and police now have the authority to stop drivers using their GPS units for such a purpose, confiscate and destroy the device and fine the driver -- we hate to see what they do to people who read books and feel emotion. As far as we can tell, it's not actually illegal to own such a device, just illegal to use it for such a nefarious purpose, but at the same time Swiss government has issued a list of "illegal" navigation systems for retailers to remove from their shelves, including devices from TomTom, Garmin, Mio, Navman, Medion, Route66, Packard Bell, Sony and ViaMichelin. TomTom's response was polite but concerned: "We are aware that the Federal Highways Department (ASTRA) has issued a statement related to GPS navigation and safety camera alerts. However, TomTom develops all of its products and services with ease of use and safety as a priority and we believe that our safety camera solution enhances road safety and security in Switzerland. We believe our safety camera services are fully legal to use and to sell. As a matter of course however, we are working with ASTRA to fully understand their view on the current legal situation." Tourists should switch off the device or at least keep away from traffic cam info while driving through the country, but it seems like the Swiss people will have to figure out how to get rid of this potentially overreaching law themselves.
_________________ Formerly known as Lost_Property
And NO that's NOT me in the Avatar.
Joined: Feb 01, 2006 Posts: 2543 Location: Rainham, Kent. England.
Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 3:03 pm Post subject:
Evidently the Swiss are very strict on speeding, no 10% + 2mph, a couple of kph over the limit and your wallet is a lot lighter.
Can't you find an alternative route just south of Switzerland? It may put a few more miles on the clock and add a little time but could be worth it in the end.
And don't forget, you need a 'vignet', I think it's called, to allow you to drive on their motorways, you have to buy one for a year even if you only use part of a motorway. I believe it's about €40 but if found without one its a €100 fine plus another €40 for the 'vignet'.
NAH, AVOID SWITZERLAND. _________________ Formerly known as Lost_Property
And NO that's NOT me in the Avatar.
Joined: Sep 06, 2006 Posts: 1618 Location: East Hertfordshire
Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 5:02 pm Post subject:
Although you can buy the vignets on ebay (I sold mine there), but you need to be as sure as you can about the seller, as you don't want to be found with an illegal one (it is illegal for instance to remove them from the windscreen after use and reuse). Mine was a surplus unused one bought for reasons I am too embarrassed to go into
You'd probably get one for less than £20. _________________ David
(Navigon 70 Live, Nuvi 360)
Joined: Feb 01, 2006 Posts: 2543 Location: Rainham, Kent. England.
Posted: Sat Jul 24, 2010 8:26 pm Post subject:
Quote:
excluding the CH speed camera data.
That may not be enough. Several months ago, maybe even last year, there was a similar post. Someone said it was illegal to have ANY speed cameras on the device, including those of other countries. I can't remember the final conclusion.
I've done a search but can't find the post unfortunately. Maybe someone else will remember. _________________ Formerly known as Lost_Property
And NO that's NOT me in the Avatar.
That may not be enough. Several months ago, maybe even last year, there was a similar post. Someone said it was illegal to have ANY speed cameras on the device, including those of other countries. I can't remember the final conclusion........
Would seem very obtuse for CH to penalise users of non-CH data.
I would like this very much clarified. After all, for many years, some users did not use their GPS with FIXED camera data in the rest of Europe because INCORRECTLY they thought it was illegal. For clarity,
On mainland Europe but excluding Switzerland - devices that identify non FIXED cameras of that country are illegal.
Switzerland - devices identifying ANY speed camera in Switzerland is illegal
But in Switzerland - can they really smack you for using a GPS that has an icon of a speed camera in Holland?
Joined: Feb 01, 2006 Posts: 2543 Location: Rainham, Kent. England.
Posted: Sat Jul 24, 2010 9:15 pm Post subject:
Quote:
But in Switzerland - can they really smack you for using a GPS that has an icon of a speed camera in Holland?
From what I can remember that appears to be the case. I've tried to find the previous post again but still no luck. _________________ Formerly known as Lost_Property
And NO that's NOT me in the Avatar.
Joined: Feb 01, 2006 Posts: 2543 Location: Rainham, Kent. England.
Posted: Sat Jul 24, 2010 10:06 pm Post subject:
The main point was.
Quote:
To be on the safe side I would say take them all off the device, depending upon which device you have it might be an option to have a spare memory card with speed cameras and one without, only use the one without the cameras whilst in the Swiss teritory
_________________ Formerly known as Lost_Property
And NO that's NOT me in the Avatar.
How's about this then - which I believe refers to SWITZERLAND (only) traffic controls..... Eidgenössisches Departement für Umwelt, Verkehr, Energie und Kommunikation UVEK
Bundesamt für Strassen ASTRA, As at February 2007 so may be subject to later law:
Quote:
2. When does a GPS device become an illegal warning tool?
Any GPS device that contains a warning function (“Warn points of interest/POIs”) that warns about traffic controls carried out by the Swiss police, is an illegal tool in accordance with the provisions of the Swiss Federal Road Traffic Act. This applies to all warning devices, i.e. regardless whether they detect mobile police controls or fixed installations such as speed cameras, traffic light monitoring devices, etc.
It is only devices that warn about mobile or fixed speed controls, traffic light monitoring cameras and all other forms of traffic controls carried out by the police on Switzerland’s roads that are prohibited. Devices that indicate other points of interest such as car parks, filling stations, hotels, restaurants, etc., are perfectly legal.
Thus all GPS devices (navigation systems, mobile phones, etc.) as well as all combinations of devices (e.g. GPS combined with a mobile phone or laptop, PDA equipped with navigation software and GPS mouse), are illegal if they contain warn POIs.
3. Information for consumers
…...
If you have a GPS device in your motor vehicle, check that it does not contain any watrn POIs concerning traffic controls on Switzerland’s roads (speed and traffic light cameras, general police controls, etc.). Delete any existing stored locations and refrain from carrying out any further updates.......
......
5. Entering Switzerland with a GPS device
When entering Switzerland, people who have a GPS device in their possession must ensure that it does not contain any warn POIs concerning Swiss road traffic controls (mobile or fixed speed measurement devices, traffic light cameras, general police controls, etc.).
I have just taken a quick look at the TomTom Swiss web-site and, from from what I can see, it is not possible to subscribe/download Speed camera data for any country if you are based in Switzerland. So unless TT do not know either and are just playing safe, it would appear that to have ANY speed camera POI warning on your SatNav for ANY country whilst in Switzerland, is a no-no.
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