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james_uk9 Occasional Visitor
Joined: Apr 16, 2005 Posts: 26
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Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 5:00 pm Post subject: |
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MaFt wrote: | Almahadeus wrote: | Just look at this thread for god's sake. Who needs a poll when you have 35 pages of objections building up over the last couple of days from people of this very community. |
it's not actually 35 pages of objections. there are still a large number of positive comments.
MaFt |
Dress it up how u like mate! The objections far outweigh the positive comments. A large number can still constitute an extremely small percentage.
So, to say it as it is:
There are an even larger number of people opposed. You know this! All at PGPSW know this, Hence the reason there will be NO official poll on the matter.
The longer the PGPSW team continue to reply selectively to criticism, the more irate and determined to oppose the members of the community shall become.
With no input, autocratic decisions risk not taking into account how they will impact the community. Continued and regular autocratic decision making will lead to distrust, low morale and inefficiency, and this my friends is where you are at! _________________ Garmin XT |
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ccsnet Regular Visitor
Joined: May 01, 2005 Posts: 101 Location: Lancashire
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Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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tomtomgo wrote: | IF PGPSW had put this database together and wanted to charge for it then i would have no problem whatsoever but this was done by the members for the members, a member collated it, then PGPSW host it. | Dito - that was my point a few posts ago... again if £2 covers admin only fine but not to cover the cost of the data especially as the new POI recording software is designed to contribute....
I also have no doubt this will be charged for and I would be happy to do so as long as my money was been used for the administration costs only.... if it is for the data then I would feel that those that had contributed where getting ripped off...
Terran _________________ http://www.letscommunicate.co.uk/carpc/ |
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ps73uk Regular Visitor
Joined: Jun 15, 2005 Posts: 116
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Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 5:15 pm Post subject: |
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james_uk9 wrote: | Dress it up how u like mate! The objections far outweigh the positive comments. A large number can still constitute an extremely small percentage. |
That point i must admit i do agree with, even though i have gone i record on this forum to state i personally have no objection to paying for the database, it would seem the vast majority posting at the moment are firmly against the idea.[/b] _________________ Garmin Streetpilot i3,
Tomtom One
_________________
Paul |
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MaFt Pocket GPS Staff
Joined: Aug 31, 2005 Posts: 15265 Location: Bradford, West Yorkshire
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Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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ps73uk wrote: | i personally have no objection to paying for the database |
ditto. i have no objection either.
MaFt |
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james_uk9 Occasional Visitor
Joined: Apr 16, 2005 Posts: 26
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Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 5:40 pm Post subject: |
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That point i must admit i do agree with, even though i have gone i record on this forum to state i personally have no objection to paying for the database, it would seem the vast majority posting at the moment are firmly against the idea.[/b][/quote
Exactly! When all is said and done, be it £2 a month, £20 a year, or whatever is eventually decided, this issue has gone beyond simply the cost implications to download the db.
The Miss-management of the whole situation will in my belief be the deciding factor for most people. It is simply not good enough to retort with claims that the men in charge are not PR guru's, and then continue to ingnore the ill feeling that is being generated.
Imho, the number one priority for any commercial operation that finds themselves in this situation should be damage limitation. For whatever reasons, to put it in plain English, Now is the time that PGPSW need to apply diplomacy to the whole situation before it escalates into something beyond their control.
Ignore the baited comments in this thread, you have far more important issues to resolve, and playin tit for tat in this thread should be the furthest thing from your minds.
You have messed up, go deal with it sooner rather than later or you could end up in serious trouble. _________________ Garmin XT |
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h5djr Lifetime Member
Joined: Feb 25, 2005 Posts: 228 Location: St Neots Cambs UK
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Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 5:44 pm Post subject: |
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I would also have no objection to paying a reasonable price for the upgrades, especially if the money collected was used to fund a version than was downloadable direct to Destinator PN.
The current method involes jumping through very many hoops !
So much so that I current run with a commercial database and program which is simplicity itself to use and update.
I enjoy this site and have gained a lot of very useful information, but I'm sure it's becomming more and more time consuming to administer. _________________ Dave R (h5djr)
TomTom XL + Audi A3 (with navigation) |
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aliendad Frequent Visitor
Joined: Jan 22, 2004 Posts: 278 Location: Romford UK
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Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 5:48 pm Post subject: |
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One problem I have always felt ,is that us Brits are frequently jealous & envious of others making money, I fell it's the moaners who don't want to pay are the greedy ones, not the team.
I'm happy to pay, but perhaps for the moaners, is it possible to say per month the area of the country that has been updated? in case it isn't relevant to the purchaser before they buy. |
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conroyd Occasional Visitor
Joined: Feb 08, 2005 Posts: 33
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Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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iankb wrote: | Vortex wrote: | ... have a proper poll and make the details available. |
What would be the point of that?
A poll would automatically be biased towards the objectors.
Why? Because people with strong objections will say that they will never pay for it (to enforce their objection), while a significant proportion of those would still pay for it anyway. Supporters would have no reason to tell a white lie, since it wouldn't make sense for them to say that they would pay for it, and then not.
Since a poll is basically anonymous, there is no commitment on the part of the voter to follow through on his vote. |
So outline one situation where you would use a poll then ?
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smstextaddict Lifetime Member
Joined: Nov 26, 2005 Posts: 82 Location: oxford
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Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 5:58 pm Post subject: |
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Question for the PGPS lot who do the database, how much does it cost a month to run the camera location downloads? |
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s_roberts Occasional Visitor
Joined: Jun 08, 2005 Posts: 20
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Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 6:01 pm Post subject: |
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It has nothing to do with Brits, do you NOT understand that the datasbase is created by the users and now they want to charge the users that help created it - this is what the problem is.
How would you like it if you helped create something and then you were sold your own creation ? You need to use your brains on this one, it has nothing to do with the £2 charge at all - if they introduce this then those people that submitted cameras to they can set up parallel web site and see what this site can do about this ?? Most of the negative comments revolve around that fact that the database will no longer be as up to date as thos who contribute to the cameras will no longer assist in this.
Unless Pocket GPS some how compensates these people (which will be difficult) the database will be useless |
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CarMad Occasional Visitor
Joined: Dec 20, 2005 Posts: 3
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Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 6:03 pm Post subject: |
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MaFt wrote: | ps73uk wrote: | i personally have no objection to paying for the database |
ditto. i have no objection either.
MaFt |
Really a moderator of the forum doesn't object. Now I must confess that is very surprising. 8O
On any other forum that I'm a part of and I'm a member of a fair few.. :D I haven't even seen anything like this where so few moderators are saying anything or at the very least defending their possition on the issue. If I was to go back and count all the posts for and against I would suggest it would be 80% against 20% for and I think I'm being generous.
After days there has been very very little comunication with your users, I think they deserve an updated statement on the front page of the site with an update at the very least.
I think I will take it as a given that no site moderators are in PR... |
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conroyd Occasional Visitor
Joined: Feb 08, 2005 Posts: 33
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Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 6:05 pm Post subject: |
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MaFt wrote: | ps73uk wrote: | i personally have no objection to paying for the database |
ditto. i have no objection either.
MaFt |
Surprising at it may seem, neither do I, I think £2 is pretty good value for money, I do close on 45k per year.
That's not the point so much tho' is it ? |
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smstextaddict Lifetime Member
Joined: Nov 26, 2005 Posts: 82 Location: oxford
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Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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Here's an idea, if someone submits a camera location to the site, why not ask other volunteers to check out the location to verify it, im sure enough people would be more than happy to verify a location if one was submitted. |
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conroyd Occasional Visitor
Joined: Feb 08, 2005 Posts: 33
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Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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conroyd wrote: | I do close on 45k per year.
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That's miles, not pounds. BTW |
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chris_w Pocket GPS Verifier
Joined: Nov 09, 2004 Posts: 628 Location: West Yorkshire
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Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 6:14 pm Post subject: |
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There have been a lot of constructive replies in between some of the more emotional ones : -
I'm just interested what everyone else thinks.....
What would people be prepared to pay for?
there have been a lot of suggestions around membership.
Is this something people would be more interested to contribute to?
I'm a paying member of another site and I find the member resources very useful. I suppose it would come down to what services and resources are offered.
What would we like to see?
if we can start answering some of these questions we might just be able to move this forward.
Any suggestions? _________________ Thanks,
Chris |
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