Speed Camera Database to Turn Professional

cantgetlost · Frequent Visitor Joined: Nov 14, 2005 Posts: 291

I now know where I went wrong, I should have got loads of people to work for free and then told them a year or two later that that they were the mugs starting my new business and by the way you guys and gals will now have to pay for your work!
Sh1t guys what a business plan, the banks will love you Smile

Bankers rule the world, look at Bush and Blair, Two of the biggest BANKERS I've ever come across Wink

Only joking guys, just like you appear to be.
This really sucks!

boatmanpw · Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2005 1:10 am Post subject:

I am a member of a boat club. When it was first formed the members built the moorings, slipway and later a clubhouse (a shed, really). Then, every so often a working day was held and the members pitched in and did whatever work was needed to keep the place in good order.

As time passed the membership grew, the moorings and clubhouse were extended, a bar installed (all by voluntary work by the members), then a bar steward employed and an annual subscription became necessary to pay for wages, overheads such as gas, electricity, rates and the like.

Work days continued to be held and just as before, the members joined in the work, keeping down the cost of running the club by doing the maintenance work themselves.

The club had been built by the members' own efforts and at their expense. Due to its increasing popularity and size however, it was no longer possible for it to be run entirely by a committee of volunteers but one person employed to help run the club didn't make it a commercial operation.

Is there not a slight parallel here ? Users have helped to build and maintain the database but it would be useless without the handful of people who have committed their time, effort and money to run this website but who now feel they cannot continue without the help of full time assistance. Surely those who bemoan the proposed charge do not expect them to pay Mike Barrett's wages out of their own pockets.

All the users of this website get enormous benefit from it and surely must accept that nothing is for nothing. Are not the only points to be argued :
1. How much to pay ? and
2. How ?

Drewzel · Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2005 1:11 am Post subject:

Hi there cantgetlost,

A bit harsh, I feel, but that is indeed how it comes across! Apologies for the appalling grammar and spelling in my previous post....obviously too anxious to submit!
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JonnyW · Occasional Visitor Joined: Sep 16, 2005 Posts: 39

TheBoyGroucho · Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2005 1:26 am Post subject:

The speed camera database is the moral property of all the people who spent their time collecting the locations of the camera sites all over the UK and forwarding them to Pocketgps. Doubtless the people who contributed their time and effort would have been far less likely to do so had they been forewarned that they would eventually have to pay to download their own data.
If Pocketgps feel that the time taken to maintain the database is too much then they should simply release it to someone else to maintain free of charge as it was first concieved.
Or at the very least anyone who has contributed to the data pool should be allowed free access to it.

cantgetlost · Frequent Visitor Joined: Nov 14, 2005 Posts: 291

Well yes! But I refrained from going over the top Laughing

I belonged to another forum some years back where they had the decency to consult people before going commercial and the whole thing going to pot Rolling Eyes

Yacht club thing is fine you knew what you were getting into, this sittuation is somehwhat different.
If you start a commercial business off the backs of others input pay up or pay for others input or we could all meet in court.
Somebody missed out in business nouse stakes before launching this proposal, a hard lesson learned early could be a vital lesson. Give this some more thought guys and make sure you wipe all the posts from all but Pocket GPS insiders.

Drewzel · Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2005 1:43 am Post subject:

cantgetlost......I cant disagree with you....

I travel 12 miles to work each morning during which i pass 1 Red Light Camera. This camera is on the database, but using the POiCapture Utility I have been able to update its position.....certainly it shows more accurately now using TT5 than the previous entry.....currently I have not yet uploaded the file to this site.......I am still undecided whether to carry on and do this or just leave the existing camera where it is following this anouncement.....or maybe there are hundreds of other PocketGPSWorld users out there who pass this camera everyday and are about to update its position! (North Featherstone Crossroads, Near Pontefract, West Yorkshire).....any takers??
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Regards,

Andrew

JonnyW · Occasional Visitor Joined: Sep 16, 2005 Posts: 39

NoLCD · Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2005 1:44 am Post subject:

I am in a dilema on one hand I would be happy to pay for this info (I do 30K+ miles per year so actually use it a lot) on the other I like the 'community spirit' of the way the db is maintained.
As mentioned frequently, how about a 'reward' scheme for new/verification/deletion of sites?

If it is causing such a problem to maintain then just drop it from PGW? The inference is it is a big task (I know that it will have much work required to keep it updated). The site would still have its sponsors and the income. Assuming that people still visit it after removing this arduous task.

Perhaps a poll of how people arrived at this site in the first place would (i.e.the camera database) show that what an effective hook it is, which advertisers must follow?

Maybe another answer to split the data into regions? You pay for where you want (hey garmin manage it!!) Another overhead but with the £120K (sic) you have the resource.

Fees would require all kinds of admin, terms and conditions and I guess legal advice as to PGW's position. Just now it is caveat emptor or more correctly 'use this database at your own peril'.

However I guess this the way it will go and if the original question was posed 'if you had never had a way of cheaply locating speed cameras would you pay a small fee for it?' Answer yes. But I don't think this is what was asked...

BTW my i3 kept boinging the whole of the West side of the M25 with old cameras today, but the noise was free and I just took the opportunity to update the data, next time??

Bruggen · Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2005 1:51 am Post subject:

Absolutely Disgraceful !!!

You have lied to this community in that you said that the camera database would always be free to download. You provide no statistics of your supposed majority at Basingstoke saying that it would be a good idea to charge for the service. You have probably based your figures on the information that you say you got there. I feel that you are profiteering from the work carried out by volunteers. I will not submit any further information to this site as others have stated.
You are also short sighted in that you state that the database will be more accurate due to you employing people to go out and check the locations, but you can't possibly afford to employ enough people to cover the entire country. many, like myself will no longer provide you with information from right now so your database will be more innacurate starting from now; so how do you think that is an improvement?
You will not see a single penny from me as I will certainly not pay for innacurate information. I will be getting my info from Tom Tom in future as they will maintain accuracy and are at the very least, honest about their intentions. In short, I object to being lied to and I feel that you will now be presiding over the break up of this community.

This is my last word on the subject. Thank you for what you have done in the past, but I object to your current attitude towards this community.

cantgetlost · Frequent Visitor Joined: Nov 14, 2005 Posts: 291

Well said!

JonnyW · Occasional Visitor Joined: Sep 16, 2005 Posts: 39

Regarding Copyright Issues

The PocketGPSWorld logo looks very similar to some Google Images, especially like the one here at PistonHeads:
http://www.pistonheads.com/pics/news/10869/gps_satellite-L.jpg

Is the logo an original PGPSW design or a logo located and modified/"PhotoShopped" from a Google search?

Is this another example of PGPSW getting information/files/data for [/b]FREE and using it to their advantage?

Just a thought.

Solo · Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2005 2:06 am Post subject:

Most disapointed to hear this news, is this the build up to some company making a buyout offer for PGPSW?
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AlanK · Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2005 2:07 am Post subject:

Would it not have been an idea to poll this on-line rather than the way you did?

Might have had a more constructive argument from both sides rather than the slant it has now.... or that might just be the majority speaking, who knows Question

Unplugged · Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2005 2:32 am Post subject:

The charge alone will stop me as well as most people posting updates. This will make the accuracy of the database go down to the point where people will see it as a waste of £2 and just go download it of a bittorrant site.

Keeping the Database Free but having say a professional account where say updates are more frequent or member benifits would have been a lot better than the router you have taken.

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