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RobBrady Frequent Visitor

Joined: Jul 21, 2004 Posts: 2718 Location: Chelmsford, UK
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Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 2:58 pm Post subject: Just a Solar Storm in a Teacup? |
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Wired Science reports last week's solar storm as "A Dud", but the predictions for the coming months could be worrying for GPS users.
How we are affected depends on the Earth's alignment and 1,700 solar storms are expected in the coming months.
Solar storms are hardly anything new, the sun goes through cycles and approximately every 11 years can produce solar storms that may have an impact on Earth such as producing auroras in more southern areas.
The problem with this cycle is that we have all learned to be very dependant on GPS for a whole multitude of things (not just car navigation) and the boffins are predicting that a new series of solar storms could have an impact on satellites.
It's possible that ultraviolet and X-ray radiation could actually damage GPS satellites, but the powers that be that monitor such things have an action plan to shut down some satellites preemptively.
The media is predicting everything from power cuts for months to financial institution meltdowns, but could this just be another millennium bug storm in a teacup? _________________ Robert Brady |
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BigPerk Frequent Visitor

Joined: Sep 06, 2006 Posts: 1618 Location: East Hertfordshire
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Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 4:14 pm Post subject: |
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Isn't it strange how 'successfu' preventive action gets bad publicity! If commerce and industry HAD collapsed worldwide, I guess there would have been a certain amount of criticism about 'not being prepared for the obvious risks'. So a tremendous amount of work WAS done - but after waiting for at least some catastrophe to happen, which could have been leaped on as 'typical incompetence of the preventative action taken', was the absence of disaster taken as a 'success'? Of course not, instead the media could claim it was all a total waste of vast amounts of time and money and was obviously totally unnecessary anyway!
No doubt exactly the same will happen here with the solar flares. After all, if nothing happens, who CAN prove whether any preventive action taken was good foresight or bad judgement? But you sell more papers if you can cite enormous waste and exploitation in generating commercial revenues - and after all, the media isn't in the business of having to prove anything it says is true, is it?
(Well, I enjoyed that little outburst anyway ) _________________ David
(Navigon 70 Live, Nuvi 360) |
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Guivre46 Frequent Visitor

Joined: Apr 14, 2010 Posts: 1262 Location: West London
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Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 9:15 pm Post subject: |
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GPS satellites have been operating for several years, and there have been coronal mass ejections in that time, and I'm not aware of significant problems? The variables seem to be the age of the satellites and possible breakdown of shielding, and the possibility of a super cme at some point - I'm not aware that anything super is looming? _________________ Mike R [aka Wyvern46]
Go 530T - unsupported
Go550 Live [not renewed]
Kia In-dash Tomtom |
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mccririck Frequent Visitor

Joined: Mar 21, 2010 Posts: 330 Location: Midlothian
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Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 12:57 am Post subject: |
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Guivre46 wrote: | GPS satellites have been operating for several years, and there have been coronal mass ejections in that time, and I'm not aware of significant problems? The variables seem to be the age of the satellites and possible breakdown of shielding, and the possibility of a super cme at some point - I'm not aware that anything super is looming? |
Well solar activity is reaching a high point, that is they main point. |
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lbendlin Pocket GPS Staff


Joined: 02/11/2002 22:41:59 Posts: 11878 Location: Massachusetts, USA
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Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 1:30 am Post subject: |
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there were some outages on individual GPS satellites during prior solar storms, but only one or two birds, and that won't impact the network function much. _________________ Lutz
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Guivre46 Frequent Visitor

Joined: Apr 14, 2010 Posts: 1262 Location: West London
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Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 10:07 am Post subject: |
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mccririck wrote: | Well solar activity is reaching a high point, that is they main point. |
I think they are referring to frequency of ejections not the quantity of any one. I'm an amateur astronomer, but no expert, we would need to be concerned about any massive sunspot or group of sunspots. I don't think this solar maximum presents anything unusual? That being said the Sun is still a bit of a mystery.
Edit: can't spell quantity [or need] _________________ Mike R [aka Wyvern46]
Go 530T - unsupported
Go550 Live [not renewed]
Kia In-dash Tomtom
Last edited by Guivre46 on Thu Feb 24, 2011 12:28 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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BigPerk Frequent Visitor

Joined: Sep 06, 2006 Posts: 1618 Location: East Hertfordshire
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Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 12:17 pm Post subject: |
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I'm quite surprised - the article may have a point! Just checked the RAS site and it seems that this maximum may be one of the weaker ones, so maybe not too much of a problem, unless anything unexpected happens.
(OTT - and I found out that the RAS also has a bit of Newton's apple tree as well! May give them a visit when I'm next up in town). _________________ David
(Navigon 70 Live, Nuvi 360) |
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Pjsmiffy1976 Occasional Visitor

Joined: Dec 27, 2006 Posts: 9 Location: np10
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Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:48 pm Post subject: A minor inconveniace. |
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There are numerous backups and in the part of space where the GPS saterlights are has a high level of back ground solar radation.
The loss of a few saterlites could posably decrees the acuracy of the system or increase boot time. This is at worst a minor inconveniance and newer systems often use last known position or phone signal to get a better fix. I think that the most most of us will notice is a little interferance on mobile sigal
Prehaps a few days with out gps would be good for us as my kids can't comprehend navigating without it. |
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DennisN Tired Old Man


Joined: Feb 27, 2006 Posts: 14907 Location: Keynsham
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Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 10:51 pm Post subject: |
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I think I read somewhere last week that some woman has filed a claim for ownership of the sun and intends to charge everybody for their sun tans and mere living from the light.
If my TomTom gets lost, I'll bloody well sue her!!! _________________ Dennis
If it tastes good - it's fattening.
Two of them are obesiting!! |
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Pjsmiffy1976 Occasional Visitor

Joined: Dec 27, 2006 Posts: 9 Location: np10
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Posted: Fri Feb 25, 2011 9:46 pm Post subject: |
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DennisN wrote: | I think I read somewhere last week that some woman has filed a claim for ownership of the sun and intends to charge everybody for their sun tans and mere living from the light. |
Ohh can we sue for skin cancer?
Sun burn?
Sun blindness?
Or the inconvenience of sun sneezing? |
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lbendlin Pocket GPS Staff


Joined: 02/11/2002 22:41:59 Posts: 11878 Location: Massachusetts, USA
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Posted: Fri Feb 25, 2011 10:16 pm Post subject: |
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a big +1 for the sun sneezing. That's an environmental hazard. _________________ Lutz
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