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cartman
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Joined: Nov 18, 2004
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 Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2004 5:45 pm Post subject: Legal position in UK of viewing PDA while driving |
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 Can anyone clarify the legal situation (in the UK) regarding viewing or operating a PDA's route finding info whilst driving, as there is already provision for operating mobile phones? Is there any legislation regarding the siteing of a PDA in a car ? Thanks in advance. |
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Dave
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Location: UK
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| Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2004 8:07 pm Post subject: |
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| There is no legislation against PDA's, but you have to use some common sense and not block too much of the windscreen (he says when 6 SatNav system sin-car yesterday). Although there's no legal documentation, if a Policeman pulled you over for speeding and also saw you blocking your main field of vision then I suppose he could say you are driving without due care and attention, but AFAIK that hasn't happened yet. |
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lamplight
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| Posted: Sat Dec 11, 2004 1:44 am Post subject: |
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I don't know the legalities either but I do know that in a moment of foolishness when I first got my TT3/Mio168 I got so engrossed in trying to get an alternative route that I virtually forgot I was in charge of a lethal machine - and nearly ended up in a ditch. I thought I was sensible driver until then!!
...Just a warning that these things can be very distracting when trying to tap screeens and set alternative routes etc. |
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swing
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Joined: Nov 04, 2003
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Location: Bedfordshire, UK
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| Posted: Sat Dec 11, 2004 10:51 am Post subject: Re: Legal position in UK of viewing PDA while driving |
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The law appears to be clear on this matter (well, as clear as any law can be until fully tested through the courts). When the new mobile phone law came into force in Dec 2003, it covered the hand holding of a variety of devices, not just mobile phones.
Taking summaries of the first 4 questions from the Department for Transport FAQs on this new law seem to clear up the issue for me (at least)....
| Quote: | Q1. What does the regulation say about hand-held phones?
The use of a hand-held phone or similar hand-held device while driving is now prohibited. A hand-held device is something that "is or must be held at some point during the course of making or receiving a call or performing any other interactive communication function".
A device is "similar" to a mobile phone if it performs an interactive communication function by transmitting and receiving data. Examples of interactive communication functions are sending and receiving spoken or written messages, sending or receiving still or moving images and providing access to the internet. |
Now, one could argue whether my PDA (which never connects to the Internet whilst in the car is or isn't covered by the law) - but equally it "receives data" from the GPS...
| Quote: | Q2. Is hands-free phone equipment allowed?
Provided that a phone can be operated without holding it, then hands-free equipment is not prohibited by the new regulation.
And pushing buttons on a phone while it is in a cradle or on the steering wheel or handlebars of a motorbike for example is not covered by the new offence, provided you don't hold the phone.
However, hands-free phones are also distracting and you still risk prosecution for failing to have proper control of a vehicle under Regulation 104 of the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986 if you use a hands-free phone when driving. If there is an incident, the use of any phone or similar device might justify charges of careless or dangerous driving. |
Again 2 valid points - as long as you don't hold the phone or PDA, it's fine. However, if you are not in full control of the vehicle, you may be prosecuted under other laws.
| Quote: | Q3. What about texting/internet access/video phones?
The use of a mobile phone or similar device for any of these activities while driving is also prohibited if the phone (or other device) has to be held in order to operate it. |
Restating the point - it's hand holding the device that brings this law into affect.
| Quote: | Q4. Are drivers still able to use navigation equipment, personal digital assistants (PDAs) or other computer equipment that sends or receives data (which would include GPS transmissions)?
Yes - providing that it is not a hand-held device. Use of devices other than mobile phones are only prohibited if the device performs an interactive communication function by sending and receiving data. If the device does not perform this type of function, you can use the device without breaching the regulations.
But remember the warning in the Highway Code (Rule 128) that using in-vehicle systems can be distracting. You must exercise proper control of your vehicle at all times.
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And that one seems to clear it up once and for all - a PDA is receiving GPS data, and hence should not be handheld.
However, as David says, obscuring the windscreen is a separate issue, which is why my PDA is mounted in front one of the air vents (though not attached to the air vent) to prevent the police arguing it impairs my vision. |
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Skippy
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Joined: 24/06/2003 00:22:12
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Location: Escaped to the Antipodies! 36.83°S 174.75°E
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| Posted: Sat Dec 11, 2004 9:56 pm Post subject: Re: Legal position in UK of viewing PDA while driving |
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| cartman wrote: | | Can anyone clarify the legal situation (in the UK) regarding viewing or operating a PDA's route finding info whilst driving, as there is already provision for operating mobile phones? Is there any legislation regarding the siteing of a PDA in a car ? Thanks in advance. |
The law here is pretty much based on common sense, there is no specific law regarding PDAs. The mobile phone law (as mentioned) says that you are not allowed to hold a phone in your hand. Given this, I don't think you would be wise to try and use a hand held PDA while driving.
You can (within reason) do pretty much anything at any time while driving your car (light a cigarette, talk to a passenger, adjust your stereo etc) provided that at all times you drive with due care and attention. The definition of due care and attention is up to the police and the courts to decide, but once again common sense should prevail.
You can site the PDA anywhere you like but you should locate it somewhere that you can see it easily, it doesn't interrupt your view of the road and outside of the deployment area of the airbags in the car (if fitted). Once again, there is no specific law, but they would still find a law to prosecute you under if it was deemed that the location of the PDA was dangerous or contributed to a crash.
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Dave
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| Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2004 12:07 am Post subject: |
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| I think also placing anything within the arc of the steering wheel which I believe is considered the peripheral viewing arc (normally where it's a failure under MOT if you have a chipped windscreen) would immediately cause concern from Police and also come under the undue care and attention. |
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Googlebot
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Joined: Nov 16, 2004
Posts: 97
Location: UK
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| Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2004 12:23 am Post subject: |
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| Mobile phone and similar may well be banned, but the use of a hand held PMR radio is still legal ! Having said that I only ever use mine hands free with VOX, but it shows how grey this area of the law is. |
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proctog
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Joined: Oct 28, 2004
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| Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2004 12:56 pm Post subject: |
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| Dave wrote: | | I think also placing anything within the arc of the steering wheel which I believe is considered the peripheral viewing arc (normally where it's a failure under MOT if you have a chipped windscreen) would immediately cause concern from Police and also come under the undue care and attention. |
Dave, what do you mean by "within the arc of the steering wheel"?
Glenn. |
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Houdini
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| Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:37 pm Post subject: |
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I believe....
If one was to hold the steering wheel at the 10 to 2 position (and I've heard that some peeps do) its the area of glass above and between the hands.  |
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proctog
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| Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Houdini wrote: | I believe....
If one was to hold the steering wheel at the 10 to 2 position (and I've heard that some peeps do) its the area of glass above and between the hands. |
Ah, OK, that makes sense.
Glenn. |
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Dave
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Location: UK
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| Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2004 10:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Virtually right. I can't remember the specifics, but if you check the MOT requirements there's an area of the windscreen within your peripheral vision which is so many inches high and so many inches wide. If you have a chip within this area of the screen then MOT will fail and you will have to replace your windscreen. |
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Privateer
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Joined: 30/12/2002 17:36:20
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Location: Oxfordshire, England, UK
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| Posted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 11:05 am Post subject: |
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I’m not an expert in MOT rules, but the garage that looks after my vehicles told me that the area of the windscreen that must not have any chips or damage is the whole area that is covered by the sweep of the windscreen wipers.
For about 5 years now, I’ve had a small chip the size of a 5 pence piece (8mm in diameter, or 11/16 of an inch) in the windscreen of one of my vehicles that’s just within the area that is covered by the sweep of the windscreen wipers.
Fortunately the chip hasn’t grown and also the MOT station doesn’t fail it on a technicality because the chip is not actually a problem for visibility as it’s hidden by the instrument panel.
Regards,
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Dave
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| Posted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 11:50 am Post subject: |
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Just doing a search, this is what I found...
 
The MOT specifies a windscreen area within the drivers’ immediate line of sight, known as ‘Zone A’, where any crack or damage must be contained within a 10mm diameter. It also states that any combination of minor damage that seriously restricts the drivers’ view will fail the MOT.
In addition to this area of windscreen, MOT guidelines require any chip or crack within the remainder of the area swept by the wipers to be contained within a diameter of 40mm. |
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