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classy56 Frequent Visitor
Joined: Sep 08, 2006 Posts: 441 Location: Dorset
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Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 8:26 am Post subject: |
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Wasn't there a member on here who had a friend who was a french policeman, and he supplied a document which in effect said they were legal in France?
I must admit to having no problems in wether they are legal or not, I always remove the database when travelling in France, as I only normally drive on autoroutes, my vehicle would be hard pushed to break wind let alone the 130kph speed limit _________________ Tomtom Go730T
App 8.300
Map v815.2003
To old to die young. |
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mikealder Pocket GPS Moderator
Joined: Jan 14, 2005 Posts: 19638 Location: Blackpool , Lancs
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Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 8:43 am Post subject: |
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This Post contains a written letter and translation to the French Ministry of Transport, their answer is also posted - have a read and make your own mind up - Mike |
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MaFt Pocket GPS Staff
Joined: Aug 31, 2005 Posts: 15226 Location: Bradford, West Yorkshire
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Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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mostdom wrote: |
The only one I know is Switzerland where it is illegal.Disscussed Here |
and republic of ireland - even maps with speed cams are illegal
MaFt |
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mostdom Pocket GPS Moderator
Joined: Jul 10, 2006 Posts: 1964 Location: Surrey, UK.
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Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 9:31 pm Post subject: |
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mikealder wrote: | ...have a read and make your own mind up... |
I like this as it is as almost horse's mouth enough for me but this was a year ago and much can happen in a year.
Next time I drive to france I'm going to load up the poi's. I don't envisage any problems as I don't make a habit of drawing attention to myself by speeding.
It is however too quiet on the western front, and I'm sure we will find out for sure soon enough. _________________ Dom
HERE LIES PND May it rest in peace.
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NDS Occasional Visitor
Joined: Feb 01, 2007 Posts: 6
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Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 9:38 pm Post subject: |
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I quote from the Daily Telegraph. I would certainly like to know what is the legal status of a speed camera database incorporated into a Sat Nav for use on the Continent. The Telegraph article states.........
There are, of course, electronic devices on sale that will give you plenty of warning of a speed trap ahead - but don't take them to France because the mere presence of one in your car is illegal, and being caught using one will result in a fine of £1,000, plus confiscation and destruction of the detector.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/main.jhtml?xml=/travel/2004/07/19/etfront1807.xml&page=3
If you are interested,please see the full article from the Daily Telegraph - Web page as above.
NDS |
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mostdom Pocket GPS Moderator
Joined: Jul 10, 2006 Posts: 1964 Location: Surrey, UK.
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Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 9:54 pm Post subject: |
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NDS wrote: | There are, of course, electronic devices on sale that will give you plenty of warning of a speed trap ahead - but don't take them to France because the mere presence of one in your car is illegal, and being caught using one will result in a fine of £1,000, plus confiscation and destruction of the detector. |
That to me seems to be refering more directly to radar detectors and those road angle type things and not specifically GPS devices. _________________ Dom
HERE LIES PND May it rest in peace.
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nickburt Occasional Visitor
Joined: Nov 17, 2005 Posts: 7
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Posted: Mon May 07, 2007 12:33 am Post subject: |
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mostdom wrote: | NDS wrote: | There are, of course, electronic devices on sale that will give you plenty of warning of a speed trap ahead - but don't take them to France because the mere presence of one in your car is illegal, and being caught using one will result in a fine of £1,000, plus confiscation and destruction of the detector. |
That to me seems to be refering more directly to radar detectors and those road angle type things and not specifically GPS devices. |
Exactly, a GPS/PDA with a set of POIs is not a detector.
A detector is a transmition device and that's where the legality comes in. Transmissions on illegal frequencies. |
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NDS Occasional Visitor
Joined: Feb 01, 2007 Posts: 6
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Posted: Mon May 07, 2007 11:14 am Post subject: |
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I agree with your logic, but loaded speed camera POIs on a sat nav are there for a specific purpose, to detect or warn drivers of speed cameras etc. However, I can see that devices using transmissions are illegal but all I am trying to do is to resolve the question.
" Are POI's which are loaded on a sat nav specifically to detect speed cameras, illegal in France and perhaps other Continental countries? "
NDS |
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nickburt Occasional Visitor
Joined: Nov 17, 2005 Posts: 7
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Posted: Mon May 07, 2007 5:03 pm Post subject: |
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Hmm... but ....
If they are POIs loaded on a GPS, they can't "detect" anything, only indicate a potential or reported location.
It maybe a play on words, but, "detection" suggests a device that works out where it's "target" is by use of a reflected signal (radar) or detection of the signal (ultrasonic, infrared or other frequency) produced by the speed camera.
I think a lawyer would have a field day defending a GPS/PDA/POI user. But probably wouldn't want to take on a case for a detector (eg Snooper) user. Might be loop hole created by words, but one I'd be happy to use.
There are many things that are available to buy, but illegal to use. So it comes down to how responsible the operator is. All that's needed is a disclaimer making it clear that it "may" be illegal to use it in certain situations or countries. |
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MaFt Pocket GPS Staff
Joined: Aug 31, 2005 Posts: 15226 Location: Bradford, West Yorkshire
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Posted: Mon May 07, 2007 10:20 pm Post subject: |
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nickburt wrote: |
I think a lawyer would have a field day defending a GPS/PDA/POI user. But probably wouldn't want to take on a case for a detector (eg Snooper) user. Might be loop hole created by words, but one I'd be happy to use.
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what use is a lawyer when you have 2 french coppers shouting at you in foreign speak armed with pistols grabbing at your sat nav?
MaFt |
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classy56 Frequent Visitor
Joined: Sep 08, 2006 Posts: 441 Location: Dorset
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Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 10:23 pm Post subject: |
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Quote: |
what use is a lawyer when you have 2 french coppers shouting at you in foreign speak armed with pistols grabbing at your sat nav?
MaFt |
If you have 2 french coppers "shouting" at you, then having a camera database will be the least of your problems. _________________ Tomtom Go730T
App 8.300
Map v815.2003
To old to die young. |
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mostdom Pocket GPS Moderator
Joined: Jul 10, 2006 Posts: 1964 Location: Surrey, UK.
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Posted: Sat May 12, 2007 11:58 pm Post subject: |
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Consider read my last post Here.
mostdom wrote: | I just found two more web sites that confim my findings HereandHere. |
_________________ Dom
HERE LIES PND May it rest in peace.
Navigon 7310/iPhone Navigon&Copilot |
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Andy_P Pocket GPS Moderator
Joined: Jun 04, 2005 Posts: 19991 Location: West and Southwest London
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Posted: Sun May 13, 2007 12:43 am Post subject: |
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Confirm what findings?
Those two links (both from sites advertising radar detectors!) talk about active detectors being legal in the UK. True at the moment, but likely to change (there have been discussions in parliament).
Neither of them mention the specific countries where both active detectors AND GPS-based databases are now definitely illegal (eg Eire and Switzerland).
France is still a grey area, where the letter of the law seems to allow databases but not detectors, but the law is being interpreted differently by the gendarmes. |
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mostdom Pocket GPS Moderator
Joined: Jul 10, 2006 Posts: 1964 Location: Surrey, UK.
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Posted: Mon May 14, 2007 11:16 am Post subject: |
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Andy, you have just reconfirmed my point that the information that we are all refering to is crude at best, the more websites I find singing the same song, add to the possability that this is all hear say.
We all know that detectors are illegal and we believe in the most part gps devices are not. What about the ones in between e.g. road angel. which look and act like detectors but boast that they are gps related therefore legal. I think these devices are causing the problems and why plod has been, I assume, confiscating the wrong devices. The lack of hard information does not help. I think gps navigation based devices with a database of camera locations may well be legal across the entire europe but we just can't prove it!
Debate rages ever onwards!
I'm still waiting for a responce from the swiss tourist office to add some hard facts to this debate, I might resend my e-mail soon. _________________ Dom
HERE LIES PND May it rest in peace.
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mostdom Pocket GPS Moderator
Joined: Jul 10, 2006 Posts: 1964 Location: Surrey, UK.
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Posted: Sat May 19, 2007 9:34 am Post subject: |
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Just found this on another thread. Here
999tommo wrote: | ...Unfortunately I received a broken window one night (bird strike - it was a big one!) and had to call the Gendarmes for insurance purposes. Whilst they were at my house, I showed them my TT1 and the camera database for France. They said they were not in the the sligtest bit interested in database type lists of camera locations on PND's as the camera locations are freely available on the net, like they are in the UK. They are however very interested in detectors or scramblers. This was in the Charente-Maritime region of France, in case it is of any interest to anyone. I am driving down to Aquitaine in July and will definately be using an updated French camera database then. |
_________________ Dom
HERE LIES PND May it rest in peace.
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