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Joined: 06/02/2003 23:17:38 Posts: 118 Location: United Kingdom
Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2004 9:45 am Post subject:
DavidH, are you aware of the difference in how TMC data is collected and warnings are issued compared to TrafficMaster for example? TMC data in the UK follows the traffic-flow principles compared to just reporting that there is a traffic jam.
This means that although it seems there is a traffic jam, the traffic flow can still be such that re-direction would not give you a better ETA. As such it is considered not worth mentioning...
Now I agree this goes a little bit again those of us who like to see things, however once you can just leave the system alone. Only use it for the navigation to your routes and stop 'playing', I am convinced you will see that it works great...It just doen't work as a traffic jam chaser, put it is also not marketed as one...
My advice forget about it, just use it for several months without worrying to much about and you'll see it works...
Joined: Nov 04, 2003 Posts: 2225 Location: Bedfordshire, UK
Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2004 10:56 am Post subject:
dejongj wrote:
TMC data in the UK follows the traffic-flow principles compared to just reporting that there is a traffic jam.
TM works under similar principles - it provides details of the length of the traffic jam and the expected delay over that distance. However, without it being linked into the SatNav solution, it's less useful overall.
DavidH, are you aware of the difference in how TMC data is collected
Sort of.
[This means that although it seems there is a traffic jam, the traffic flow can still be such that re-direction would not give you a better ETA. As such it is considered not worth mentioning...]
My routine route to work is using the Westway. When the Westway (A40 overhead from Egdware Road to White City) is blocked, you can sit for an hour or so before it clears, as there is no way off (depending on the problem of course). There are several other ways to get to work that I commonly use if I know there's a problem (usually 'cos I've just come INTO London on the other carriageway!).
I quite accept that I have local knowledge, but this is the main arterial road out to OXford, rather than a local minor road.
Similarly the (semi-permanent??) roadworks at Gordon House Road (Gospel Oak) block all traffic trying to get from Kentish Town to Hampstead - or vice-versa - and you have to go north around Hampstead Heath or south through Kentish Town (the railway blocks all other routes. Had I been warned at Archway, I could easily have diverted and saved about 45 minutes.
Both of these seem rather large blocks for the system to ignore, and certainly knowing the area I could avoid the long delays.
I haven't used it on long journeys, and it may be better on trunk routes. Sadly, as a poor Londoner, I hoped to avoid our standard problem that when an accident /roadworks occur, the traffic - already near saturation - locks entirely.
If within say 30 mins the system said 'look out', there would almost always (in London at least) be an alternative that would be faster, and it would be terrific. MAybe I expected too much - a sort of overhead helicopter looking for trouble!
[... Only use it for the navigation to your routes and stop 'playing', I am convinced you will see that it works great...It just doen't work as a traffic jam chaser, put it is also not marketed as one...]
I don't think I'm 'playing'!" I was putting in deliberate test routes as to start with I wasn't sure it was working at all - since I never heard anything. I now know it is, so I do leave it alone.
I wasn't expecting it to avoid jams as such. As you say, if there's no better way, then you can't do anything.
Personally I would say it was better to be told that the jam was known, but there was no better route. At the moment you don't know if that is so, or if the info has not been filed yet.
Joined: Nov 04, 2003 Posts: 2225 Location: Bedfordshire, UK
Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2004 6:08 pm Post subject:
DavidH wrote:
Similarly the (semi-permanent??) roadworks at Gordon House Road (Gospel Oak) block all traffic trying to get from Kentish Town to Hampstead.....MAybe I expected too much - a sort of overhead helicopter looking for trouble!
I think this comes down to understanding the limitations of the technology and the implementations available.
Gordon House Road is the B518 (as best as I can work out), and iTIS and Trafficmaster mainly only cover motorways and the main primary trunk road network (with a few additional roads). As such, neither would have reported the delay or roadworks on that road even though it's a popular road, and the impact of the road being shut is severe.
Also, had the more major routes have been blocked, the software may well route you only roads like this as it has no data that the road should be doing anything other than running freely.
One limitation is that you get directed off a major road due to an accident and get diverted only minor roads that are closed / slow / stationary due to others diverting too - unless the technology covered every road in the country (and that's not going to happen for a very long time) scenarios like this will occur time and time again.
Well, I certainly didn't know the limitations! Oh well, I'll hope it helps on long distance journeys.
I think someone's idea of having all cars with the telephone version of TMC (via GPSS I think?) automatically giving their position and speed and thus all knowing about any jam would be great (ignoring thoughts of Big Brother), but would doubtless need several Cray's to run it.
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