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marksfish
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Joined: Jun 25, 2005
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Location: Sandy, Bedfordshire
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 Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 1:33 pm Post subject: |
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| M8TJT wrote: | | Is that 'friends' as in facebook 'friends'. |
What I should have said is i've seen it make enemies of the best of friends.
The Brexit vote was highly charged and caused grief, even amongst close families. Stating facts is still creating a political discussion though  . Hey, I don't mind, i'm a big boy now and not easily offended by other people's opinions, I know which side my bread is buttered. Don't have a problem with anything you've said by the way 
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Kremmen
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| Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 2:00 pm Post subject: |
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I've got a friend at last
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M8TJT
The Other Tired Old Man
Joined: Apr 04, 2006
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Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK
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| Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 5:11 pm Post subject: |
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Nar, just kiddin' K.  |
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topref
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| Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 5:15 pm Post subject: |
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| I voted leave and, in my mind that meant OUT - completely. The EU negotiators are, as has been already pointed out, un-elected and are making life difficult and that's exactly what they intend. They want the peoples of the other member states to see how much hassle they (the eu) would create if they dared to try and leave 'the club' so that if they get their opportunity to vote to leave, they're going to think twice. |
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sussamb
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Joined: Mar 18, 2011
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Location: West Sussex
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| Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 5:54 pm Post subject: |
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| topref wrote: | | The EU negotiators are, as has been already pointed out, un-elected and are making life difficult ... |
However you voted I don't see how you can say this. The UK has laid down certain red lines and the EU has its constitution to stick to. Whatever is agreed has to take account of both. Regrettably the UK team some 2 years downstream still cannot say what it actually wants so it's hardly surprising we're on the back foot. If only May had sorted out what we actually wanted before triggering Article 50 it might all be over by now. As it stands now there is still a very strong chance it will implode and we'll be remaining in the EU.
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M8TJT
The Other Tired Old Man
Joined: Apr 04, 2006
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Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK
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| Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Or not in the EU but still bound by their restrictive rules with no say in the matter. (Not that we had much of a say anyway) |
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perussell
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Joined: May 12, 2006
Posts: 292
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| Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:57 pm Post subject: |
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| sussamb wrote: | | topref wrote: | | The EU negotiators are, as has been already pointed out, un-elected and are making life difficult ... |
However you voted I don't see how you can say this. The UK has laid down certain red lines and the EU has its constitution to stick to. Whatever is agreed has to take account of both. Regrettably the UK team some 2 years downstream still cannot say what it actually wants so it's hardly surprising we're on the back foot. If only May had sorted out what we actually wanted before triggering Article 50 it might all be over by now. As it stands now there is still a very strong chance it will implode and we'll be remaining in the EU. |
Well I started something here didn’t I but it’s hardly surprising. Half the problem is that both the major parties are split down the middle in terms of what they want from the negotiations. Can anybody say exactly what the Labour party’s official position is on this? I’m not sure they know themselves.
As for parliament having a vote on the final deal I can see the democratic logic to that but.....if you were the EU and knew that parliament where there may even be a slight majority to remain would have the final word would you offer us a decent deal. The EU clearly wants Brexit to fail so it’s not in their interest to offer anything palatable to the British people.
Ultimately I think it’s time for the government to start playing hardball. The evidence so far is that being nice is not working and offers are not being reciprocated. Can anybody identify one area where the EU has ceded ground yet? Galileo, which is where we came in, is but one example. If they want to shut us out then fair enough but equally we should withhold some of our “divorce” payment. |
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M8TJT
The Other Tired Old Man
Joined: Apr 04, 2006
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Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK
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| Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 7:01 pm Post subject: |
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| perussell wrote: | | Can anybody say exactly what the Labour party’s official position is on this? I’m not sure they know themselves. |
Can anyone say exactly what Labour's official stance is on anything. |
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sussamb
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| Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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Nope 
But as for withholding the divorce payment that's been signed off so that couldn't happen. We in any case are only paying what we would have paid if we remained for those extra years.
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perussell
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| Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 7:09 pm Post subject: |
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| sussamb wrote: | Nope
But as for withholding the divorce payment that's been signed off so that couldn't happen. |
I think that was signed off on the basis that we would get something out of this but at the end of the day we’ve all heard many times that “nothing is agreed until it’s all agreed” so actually I think we could backtrack on the payment..... |
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sussamb
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| Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 8:09 pm Post subject: |
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I don't think that's included in the nothings agreed etc etc. Various statements imply that's the simple cost that we're already committed to regardless of what deal is done. Depending on the deal it could be considerably more.
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DennisN
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Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 14905
Location: Keynsham
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| Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 10:20 pm Post subject: |
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Having voted to Remain, I was going to post telling you all how/why. But obviously none of you will agree with me, so I won't bother. I'm older than all of you I think (so I'm right, of course).
I shall await the day when you take the "out" attitude towards independence for Birmingham, Leeds, Manchester, Liverpool and every other little community in the UK. Luddites, all of you.
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Dennis
If it tastes good - it's fattening.
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sussamb
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| Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 10:35 pm Post subject: |
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I voted remain too
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M8TJT
The Other Tired Old Man
Joined: Apr 04, 2006
Posts: 10118
Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK
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| Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 10:39 am Post subject: |
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Nutters, both of you.  |
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Kremmen
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Joined: Mar 03, 2006
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Location: Reading
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| Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 1:10 pm Post subject: |
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Doesn't the underlying theme of this thread just show that a second referendum would be pointless as we all are sticking to our guns of in/out ?
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