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Darren
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Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40
Posts: 23848
Location: Hampshire, UK
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 Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 9:00 am Post subject: |
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| willis wrote: | | I find the decision to withdraw monthly subscriptions, in my cinical view, not one which has been taken to avoid piracy but one that has been taken to increase revenue further from subscribers |
And I can categorically state that this is not the case.
| Quote: | | What I am concerned about is, what is the next step? FUrther increase in price? Loss of the lifetime membership for contributers? PGPS is turning (turned) into a company with large corporation actions and views - some good, some bad. At the end of the day they are here to make a profit and the subscribers have been used to make and maintain the product, then they have been weened and encouraged to depend on it, next step is to bleed them dry. Or am I being cynical? |
Crikey, glass is always half empty or what! You are being very cynical and it is unwarranted. The cost of the subscription has remained at the original price for two years, indeed the annual sub is a saving of £6 over the monthly option for those that subscribed every month (and many did).
I'm happy to go on record and say that we have no plans to remove the lifetime subscription offer nor have we ever discussed the possibility, it's a valuable sales tool and rewards those who actively contribute.
We're a very very long way from being a corporate beast! We're only four people working 14hr days on this web-site and we're very proud of it and simply wish it to grow and succeed as it has done to date.
| Quote: | | Anyway, it remains a great product and a big thank you to all the contributers - you've kept my licence clean (well done PGPS for spotting the market and getting in quick, you presently have a unique product). |
And just when I was losing faith in you we almost get a compliment! Of course the camera submissions are the key but they don't magically transform themselves into error corrected databases available for 20+ platforms by magic you know!
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Darren Griffin |
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Darren
Frequent Visitor
Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40
Posts: 23848
Location: Hampshire, UK
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| Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 9:02 am Post subject: |
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| carol wrote: | | I also disagree, there must be some way that it is possible for people to subscribe to the database on a casual basis. |
And if you can suggest a method that thwarts the wide-scale theft of our work whilst retaining the ability for occasional subscribers to benefit then we'd love to hear it!
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Darren Griffin |
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willis
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Joined: Mar 06, 2006
Posts: 52
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| Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 9:19 am Post subject: |
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How about paying for a number of downloads - with a minimum purchase of twenty for £20 - no expiry date on when they can be used?
Another question to Darren (and his other three colleagues): Are you planning to a) sell the database / website / company to one of the big players for a tidy sum, b) keep on going and keep it as yours for life, c) convert it into a charity / non profit business for the good of all?
I didn't know it was just the four of you - fantastic effort, very impressive. |
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pj100uk
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Joined: Aug 30, 2007
Posts: 1
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| Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 9:24 am Post subject: |
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As a new member I hope I am permitted my opinion. My feeling is that by effectively raising the cost of obtaining the database for new members, you will in fact worsen the piracy problems.
I feel that people are more likely to part with a small amount of money to obtain a legitimate copy, than are likely to pay the £19. I think a proportion of the potential new subscribers will seek pirated versions therefore worsening the problem. |
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PaulB2005
Pocket GPS Moderator
Joined: Jan 04, 2006
Posts: 9323
Location: Durham, UK
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| Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 9:31 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | My feeling is that by effectively raising the cost of obtaining the database for new members, you will in fact worsen the piracy problems. |
If you read the previous posts you will see why the raise in price will hopefully combat piracy.
No matter how cheap the database was some will never pay. Even if it was 1p for a lifetime. As we can identify the "owner" of the database that appears on P2P and file swapping sites we can ban them and they loose all remains subs. when the database was £2 a go they'd loose £2 a time. Now its £19 a time.
As Darren has said it's already had an effect on the avalibilty of pirate copies online so it appears to be working.
Don't forget that you only have to be the first submitter of a new camera once to get a free lifetime sub, but you MUST be a subscriber when you submit that camera. |
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Darren
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Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40
Posts: 23848
Location: Hampshire, UK
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| Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 9:36 am Post subject: |
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| willis wrote: | | How about paying for a number of downloads - with a minimum purchase of twenty for £20 - no expiry date on when they can be used? |
It's something that has been suggested. We're looking into the logistics and feasibility of deploying such an option.
| Quote: | Another question to Darren (and his other three colleagues): Are you planning to a) sell the database / website / company to one of the big players for a tidy sum, b) keep on going and keep it as yours for life, c) convert it into a charity / non profit business for the good of all?
I didn't know it was just the four of you - fantastic effort, very impressive. |
We all dearly love the site and working on it. Selling up has never been discussed, we've only just started 
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Darren Griffin |
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tigre64
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Joined: Mar 11, 2004
Posts: 26
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| Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 9:39 am Post subject: |
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I don't think anyone should moan about the changes, good idea.
as far as i'm concerned £19 offers great value for money, the database is very good, i find it better and more concise than the Garmin/Cyclops database.
I don't think you can subscribe to any of the other databases for just 1 month
Oh and to add, Garmin have just announced that their (Cyclops) database is now £30 a year still more expensive, so PGPSW obviously got the competition scared 
as for security of the database, as you have to login to download it, could the download be somehow secretly stamped with the members username or email address. Or could the database be encrypted and each subscribing member issued with a unique key (suppose that depends on the numbers of subscribed members). |
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PaulB2005
Pocket GPS Moderator
Joined: Jan 04, 2006
Posts: 9323
Location: Durham, UK
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| Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 9:43 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | as for security of the database, as you have to login to download it, could the download be somehow secretly stamped with the members username or email address. Or could the database be encrypted and each subscribing member issued with a unique key (suppose that depends on the numbers of subscribed members). |
Each individual download can already be traced back to it's "owner". |
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Darren
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Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40
Posts: 23848
Location: Hampshire, UK
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| Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 9:44 am Post subject: |
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| pj100uk wrote: | | As a new member I hope I am permitted my opinion. |
Of course.
| Quote: | My feeling is that by effectively raising the cost of obtaining the database for new members, you will in fact worsen the piracy problems.
I feel that people are more likely to part with a small amount of money to obtain a legitimate copy, than are likely to pay the £19. I think a proportion of the potential new subscribers will seek pirated versions therefore worsening the problem. |
Sadly that was not borne out by the facts. There are two key issues here, people perceive it acceptable to steal things that are 'cheap' but think twice where they are not so. The £2 option was the source of 99% of the pirate copies of our database.
In the past we have seen our database available on various sites within minutes of a new release becoming available. At the moment, some 15 days after release it has still not been shared. I have no doubt that it will but £19 is a much more bitter pill to swallow than £2 and this time we're ready to take legal action and have a solicitor primed and ready to go 
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tigre64
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Joined: Mar 11, 2004
Posts: 26
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| Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 9:48 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Each individual download can already be traced back to it's "owner". |
Thats good to know. |
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GPS_fan
Pocket GPS Moderator
Joined: Jan 04, 2007
Posts: 2789
Location: Hampshire, UK
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| Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 9:56 am Post subject: |
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One point that we're also missing here is that the subscription also allows members to take part in monthly competitions, benefit from members' discounts, have access to 'members only' forums.
Subscription does not only cover the database - the database is just one of several benefits of subscription.
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Andy
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anthp
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Joined: Apr 04, 2006
Posts: 16
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| Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 10:12 am Post subject: |
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Just to add I think the Idea of paying say £20 for 10 downloads to be used when required is a very good one even if time limited. It would certainly solve my issues.
anth
as it stands, as always it makes things worse for the genuine paying user and does nothing to the pirates.
Last edited by anthp on Thu Oct 04, 2007 10:19 am; edited 1 time in total |
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M8TJT
The Other Tired Old Man
Joined: Apr 04, 2006
Posts: 10118
Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK
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| Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 10:13 am Post subject: |
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@Darren
| Quote: | | ...... We're only four people working 14hr days on this web-site and we're very proud of it ......... |
and so you jolly well should be. |
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Darren
Frequent Visitor
Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40
Posts: 23848
Location: Hampshire, UK
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| Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 10:24 am Post subject: |
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I've discussed the option of paying for a fixed number of downloads and it isn't feasible. We are constrained by the limitations of the subscription code within the software we use here and it cannot cope with such an option without a significant re-write.
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DennisN
Tired Old Man
Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 14902
Location: Keynsham
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| Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 10:29 am Post subject: |
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Can I just quickly resurrect the earlier suggestion of a free download of just the 30mph fixed (Gatso etc) cameras as a good sample of the database - it's not easy to stump up £19 for something you don't know - sure, everybody says it's great, but that's what my dentist says before she brings the needle and drills out from behind her back!! 
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Dennis
If it tastes good - it's fattening.
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