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Rotas, Please read the whole post before posting . I will remain polite but if you would have taken the time to get "the bigger picture" you would have furnished yourself with the facts.
Most people are objecting to the fact that PGPSW want to charge for material in the most collected by the same members they now want to charge.
PGPSW may own the database in name, but the content, i'm not so sure.
Before posting can i respectfully suggest that you make yourself aware of both sides of the argument.
Through this one post, you can see many things have been dragged into the argument by all parties only to be ripped apart by claim and counter claim, frankly it has become a debacle.
As far as objectors are concerned it is about, and has always been about the database that they have put together.
All PGPSW do is collate it and host it. If that is taking up too much time and bandwidth ( the original reason given by PGPSW) then give it back to the members to collate and host utilising their time and bandwidth.
A really simple solution, - will it be implemented, of course not,- would you give away a lottery ticket you knew had yesterdays winning numbers on it!!.
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2005 12:39 pm Post subject: Me too!
Calligrapher wrote:
Yes, I noticed posts appear and disappear - thought I was getting older than I thought, could it be the new, more powerful aproach?
, it would even appear my little £0.02 worth was deleated. If I search for my postings the system says I have posted 10, this being the 11'th. With 3 PM's which I guess might be counting this then leaves 2 postings deleted.
Although new to the forum, posting wise, I have been a reader for many months. Maybe not for much longer if my words are not even allowed to be heard.
Joined: Aug 07, 2004 Posts: 388 Location: Surrey, UK
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2005 12:57 pm Post subject:
As someone of a fairly moderate disposition on this and other forums, I was a little unsure when others have said that their posts have been censored or disappeared - until now.
About 12 hours ago, I posted onto this forum the fact that yesterday I visited the 'other site' and was surprised to see how far it had progressed over such a short period. In my post I mentioned the 'other site's' address as this is also the site's name.
My post has been deleted altogether.
This is not a democracy anymore, this is not a community anymore.
This is now a dictatorship and I am disgusted at the pettyness and dictatorial style that is now prevalent.
Simon as an old hand , i wonder if you remember two old posters "delboy"& "Oz".
They used to give & get a lot of flak on here a while ago, They broached this subject about PGPSW being a dictatorship and they were basically hounded out.
Were these guys clairvoyant or something?.
Joined: Dec 29, 2005 Posts: 5 Location: Towcester, S. Northants.
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2005 1:29 pm Post subject:
Tomtomgo, Thank you for your courteous reply. I have in fact been following the debate and read each post. I did not feel an epistle of epic length covering each and every point necessary or desirable. It would seem a number of those starting out on the financial side of the argument switched arguments at the point they realised their original argument had less value to it than a Netto shopping bag.
As for the idea of ownership of the database, I’m sure that most people, like myself, actually enjoy adding to it and do so without any sense of ownership. I pass through many safety camera areas of which I have not contributed to and I use the time issued information of others with gratitude, as I’m sure they do when they pass cameras I’ve submitted.
However, to expect, as a right, the information as a whole for a fraction of the input (if any in most cases), does seem to border on usury. These guys are hold down full time jobs and use their time, their energy and doubtless their money to keep this thing up and running. I don’t think it unreasonable of them to ask for some recompense.
If on the other hand you are offering to take on the effort and expense yourself and establish a new FREE service, then I applaud your altruistic efforts greatly. If you need a copy of the database I believe you can download it from PGPSW.com, or find them in the latest AA road atlas, I'm sure your local library will have a copy if you don't to pay for it.
Finally, please don’t take me too seriously, I’m enjoying the forum, the debate (note debate not debacle), and, albeit ever so slightly, the feel of my tongue in my cheek.
Joined: Jul 10, 2004 Posts: 296 Location: In the Office
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2005 1:36 pm Post subject:
tomtomgo wrote:
Simon as an old hand , i wonder if you remember two old posters "delboy"& "Oz".
They used to give & get a lot of flak on here a while ago, They broached this subject about PGPSW being a dictatorship and they were basically hounded out.
Were these guys clairvoyant or something?.
Why Hello tomtomgo, long time no see.
Well as you can see i'm still here, although i 've been reading these forums,instead of writing in them. As for the circumstance of me writing again, i'm disgusted that they've even thought about charging for downloads. As they said themselves,it's FREE, and should remain so.
PGPSW wrote:
We invest a great deal of time and energy in compiling and publishing these databases and it is grossly unfair that a small minority think they can profit from our work, spread the word and ensure that everyone knows where to come for the FREE database.
No worries Rotas, i take your points on board.
We will beg to differ, as on the other points about setting up a newbie , have a look around , it is already happening.
I wont be naughty and get stood in the corner with my hands on my head and post the address but it is out there.
Hello delboy, OZ has gone back to .. er OZ. Caught up with him in Melbourne in May, reckons he misses it all.
He reckons he is stirring them all up on the forums downunder.
TomTom launched down there earlier this year.
Joined: May 16, 2005 Posts: 47 Location: Norfolk, England
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2005 1:57 pm Post subject: Re: Speed Camera Database to Turn Professional
[quote=]POIHandler on charge £11 approx per year, although not up to date like your database it's still a resonable charge compared to Tomtom and the "per download" basis.
Regards,
KnightOwl[/quote]
I subscribe to POIHandler - it costs €12 per year rather than £11 above (checked this morning - still the same). POI Warner also cost €12 to register. I went for this option simply for ease of use.
I automatically download a whole batch of "safety camera" waypoints daily to my Ipaq for use with POIWarner and TT5. If I have captured some unmarked cameras, they are automatically uploaded to the database.
The other thing I really prefer is the time-related warnings that you receive from POIW rather than distance-related as in TT5. A relatively consistant 30 second warning is much more useful than the inflexible "too-early when slow", "too-late when fast" fixed distance alert.
Joined: Apr 08, 2004 Posts: 256 Location: Hampton, Middlesex, UK
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2005 2:18 pm Post subject:
I posted this quote a few minutes ago, but it was deleted by the Mods.
By imposing censorship and trying to slant the discussions in their favour, they are showing their true colours and are continuing to self-destruct.
The problem there is we would still have to pay eBay charges so need to set a price that covers the auction listing fee. It will always remain FREE here but I was thinking of a nominal £1 fee for eBay where we would email the database to the recipient.
The listing would clearly state that it's FREE here but if they prefer it sent to them via email they can have it for £1.
It was probably removed due to it being a duplicate post, i posted the exact same thing a few pages back and its still there so it may be for that reason,else the delete button is out of control
It was probably removed due to it being a duplicate post, i posted the exact same thing a few pages back and its still there so it may be for that reason,else the delete button is out of control
Funny, I normally get here via the Forum Hot Topics link, and when I looked just, it said 355 posts (and my first thought was "that seems to have gone doewn from yesterday evening").
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, it would even appear my little £0.02 worth was deleated. If I search for my postings the system says I have posted 10, this being the 11'th. With 3 PM's which I guess might be counting this then leaves 2 postings deleted.
