Hi! We see you’re using an ad-blocker. We’re fine with that and won’t stop you visiting the site.
But as we’re losing ad-revenue from this then why not make a donation towards website running costs?. Or you could disable your ad-blocker for this site. We think you’ll find our adverts are not overbearing!
Joined: 20/08/2002 11:51:57 Posts: 3859 Location: Essex, UK
Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2005 12:19 pm Post subject: Speed Camera Database to Turn Professional
The positive feedback that we have been getting about the PocketGPSWorld.com Speed Camera Database since its launch over 3 years ago has been nothing short of amazing. I'm sure that all our visitors understand the huge amounts of work that we (but mostly Richard Davies) have put into the application and continue to do so each and every month.
Since the launch of our free in-house POICapture for Safety Cameras utility http://www.pocketgpsworld.com/poicapture.php (a fantastic application courtesy of Lutz Bendlin) the Speed Camera Database is now reaching new improved levels of accuracy.
We received the following bit of feedback on POICapture from an attendee of The PocketGPSWorld.com Event held in November: "The only problem I had was not being able to find any new speed cameras on the run home 330 miles (ish) and every camera I passed was spot on which also speaks highly of the quality data the site provides – So I never got to try the new application – I am sure it will be used over the coming weeks."
In fact this gentleman could have used the application as we are now encouraging everyone to also report every existing camera (it is very easy to use) so we can repeatedly confirm locations. We hope also to be able to professionally develop even further systems to verify every UK camera location ensuring data accuracy as near to 100% as possible. We foresee us covering other European countries in the future as well.
To introduce the first stage in the 'professionalisation' of the Speed Camera Database we asked many of our 750 visitors at the PocketGPSWorld.com Basingstoke Event to complete a feedback form. This form included questions as to a possible future fair charging system for the downloads. Some said they were in favour of a yearly fixed charge for unlimited downloads and some were opposed to any charge at all. However, the overwhelming majority of the 100s that completed the form agreed that a charge of £2.00 per download was reasonable.
Charging £2.00 per download will not only facilitate our very first full-timer, but eventually allow professional physical checking (through
sampling) of the camera positions.
The team have thought long and hard about this decision and have decided if we are to turn PocketGPSWorld.com from a "hobby site" (run on a part-time only basis by enthusiasts with full-time jobs) into a professional company that offers a professional service, we need a full-timer on board.
This is where Mike Barrett steps up to the plate.
Mike's experience encompasses an entire range of industries from finance, to manufacturing and retail. He has been involved in the complete development lifecycle for software projects commissioned for some of the World's best known corporate names. Starting his career before the invention of the PC and the Internet as we now know it Mike has been involved in creating global communications solutions.
In the late 80's and early 90's when the Internet was in an embryonic stage he was using the same technologies that were used to build the Internet. Mike is an accredited TMB (Technology Means Business) Adviser and is a regular presenter of seminars and workshops for BusinessLink. Together with fellow PocketGPSWorld.com team member Robert Brady, he was recognised by the UK Government E-Commerce Awards for the marketing and development of the best new UK e-commerce site for 2003.
Currently, huge amounts of Mike's, Robert's and Darren's time is taken up organising the regular PocketGPSWorld.com events - they are currently planning our next one in Edinburgh for over 2000 visitors! Regulars will already be aware of the mammoth amount of work Darren Griffin, alongside our moderators, contributes to the forums.
I'm sure all those that know Mike would agree that he would be the perfect candidate for our first full-timer! Mike proposes to change his job in January 2006. To coincide with this, the charge for the download will also be initiated in January.
We know that some of you will be disappointed that we have introduced a charge, but for the site to get to the next level we felt we have had to do this. We promise that we already know every single argument against charging (commercially and emotionally) - we as a team have all, as individuals, used them ourselves during our many discussions on the subject.
In the interest of transparency, our initial main argument against charging was the fact that the database is added to regularly by our community for free. This is a level of goodwill that we take very seriously and hugely appreciate. However, we anticipate that a few contributors may object to supplying us with future updates for what is now transitioning into more of a commercial operation. We would absolutely respect their decision on this without reserve and, certainly in our eyes, this would not impact their standing in the community.
The counter argument is that the huge costs (think bandwidth!) and substantial maintenance of the website MUST be addressed. The website acts as the only vehicle for attracting additions to the Speed Camera Database.
Without the website and without you, our dedicated website community, there would be no database.
We truly hope that the PocketGPSWorld.com community will not only carry on supporting us by sending in new cameras, but also encourage us as we go through our transition from hobby to professional!
Joined: 20/08/2002 11:51:57 Posts: 3859 Location: Essex, UK
Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2005 1:42 pm Post subject:
We are currently looking at a number of payments options, PayPal is on of them but we are also looking into taking Debit cards through an online provider. We will also be taking cheques for those of you who dont trust online payment systems. _________________ Mike Barrett
Joined: Nov 16, 2004 Posts: 1077 Location: Chester-le-Street & York
Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2005 1:46 pm Post subject:
While I don't object to a charging model I think charging £2.00 PER DOWNLOAD is a massive, massive, massive mistake on the part of PocketGPS world.
One of the most important things is to be able to keep your camera database up to date, charging per download would massively discourage this. Instead of updating once a month I'll update once every 6 months, if that. It would also discourage me from providing any updates.
I would strongly recommend a year long subscription model, a price of say £20 for a year would be fair.
The current charging model is about the worst possible way you could have done it
Also people who used this site for free did contribute by adding cameras to the database encouraged by the notion that the database was for free and the new charge may put them off from adding any new contribution as it would seem that it is a job for professionals who are getting paid to do it.
Joined: Nov 16, 2004 Posts: 1077 Location: Chester-le-Street & York
Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2005 2:11 pm Post subject:
Dan_Gleebitz wrote:
£2.00 per download is not a massive, massive, massive amount of money. But if you think it is? Then only download 6 times a year for a total of £12.00 which is still less than your yearly sub idea of £20.00.
Charging any amount "per download" is not something I would like at all. It provides an upfront discouragement for me keeping my database up to date, which I don't like at all.
I would think some sort of price reduction is in order for people who want to always have the latest version. Having to pay £24 to download every month is too much IMO and doesn't reward loyal users, so some reduction is in order. £20 is acceptable, £12-15 would be even better..
To reiterate, it's NOT the charge I object to, it's the per download charge which I feel is completely the wrong approach.
Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2005 2:19 pm Post subject: A sad day for Pocket GPS World.
I'm not regular contributor but I like this site and feel compelled to express my utter disappointment at this announcement.
The original motivation of those that contributed to this database was to help others. It would seem that your motivation for making this "professional" is your own greed. You have a great database already, you don't NEED to start charging for it. Are the HUGE costs of hosting this site really not being covered by the adverts? Care to share your accounts with us?
If you go commercial do you expect people to keep contributing to your wealth? Sure, it'll be cheap (to start with) but can you resist the urge to increase prices for your own profit? Oh, and prepare to start being sued, people don't generally sue volunteers but if you're making money..
It's your train set, so do what you like with it, just don't expect people to see going "professional" as anything other than lining YOUR pockets from other people's efforts. Let's hope somebody starts an alternative free database soon.
Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2005 2:29 pm Post subject: Re: A sad day for Pocket GPS World.
AlanCollier wrote:
I'm not regular contributor but I like this site and feel compelled to express my utter disappointment at this announcement.
The original motivation of those that contributed to this database was to help others. It would seem that your motivation for making this "professional" is your own greed. You have a great database already, you don't NEED to start charging for it. Are the HUGE costs of hosting this site really not being covered by the adverts? Care to share your accounts with us?
If you go commercial do you expect people to keep contributing to your wealth? Sure, it'll be cheap (to start with) but can you resist the urge to increase prices for your own profit? Oh, and prepare to start being sued, people don't generally sue volunteers but if you're making money..
It's your train set, so do what you like with it, just don't expect people to see going "professional" as anything other than lining YOUR pockets from other people's efforts. Let's hope somebody starts an alternative free database soon.
This is a sad day.
--Alan Collier
Well said Alan. That is exactely how I felt when I read the announcement.
I have used the camera database since I bought my TomTom Classic and have been very pleased with it. I have no objections to paying for this service. I would, however, propose a two tier charging approach.
Tier one: £2 per individual download, as proposed. This gives newcomers to the service the oppurtunity to try out the database before...
Tier two: £20 for an annual subscription service. This way I don't have to keep entering my debit card details every time I need to update the database.
I feel this would provide a best of both worlds solution.
I have no objection to the £2 per download charge at all, bearing in mind the usefulness of the speed camera database, and all the other help and information I have received from this site.
I don't do Paypal either, and prefer to pay by credit card for anything I buy on the net. However, I wonder how economical it would be to collect many small value payments by either credit card or cheque. For example, many retailers have a 'minimum spend' before they will accept a card or cheque due to the processing charges they incur. Would the same thing apply in this case?
A subscription might therefore make more sense, but I don't know whether the punters (ie: us) would go for it. _________________ HP rx5935, 2GB SD Card, TTN 6.1, GPSDash
Joined: Nov 16, 2004 Posts: 1077 Location: Chester-le-Street & York
Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2005 2:35 pm Post subject:
Jammy1 wrote:
I have used the camera database since I bought my TomTom Classic and have been very pleased with it. I have no objections to paying for this service. I would, however, propose a two tier charging approach.
Tier one: £2 per individual download, as proposed. This gives newcomers to the service the oppurtunity to try out the database before...
Tier two: £20 for an annual subscription service. This way I don't have to keep entering my debit card details every time I need to update the database.
I feel this would provide a best of both worlds solution.
That gets my vote.
I would also like to add that I feel that PocketGPSWorld are treating their contributors with contempt, but I'll get over that :P
Joined: Nov 16, 2004 Posts: 1077 Location: Chester-le-Street & York
Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2005 2:37 pm Post subject:
Dan_Gleebitz wrote:
Sir, don't take this the wrong way, but I would suggest you read your own posts before you respond. Such as the one you made four above this where you stated the following.
Sigh.. yet again. I didn't say I objected to the amount. READ IT AGAIN. I object to being charged EVERY TIME I download.
Before I suggest basic comprehension classes I would suggest we both understand each others points so arguing over semantics at this point is futile.
This "professionalisation" is a bad idea for a "hobby site"
does not matter how much you charge, most if not all members would not feel home no more.
No one would interest to support a commercial site, because you give them money again which they already charge you.
How about pay me some money if i upload some new camera, or helping others to solve their problem.
Posted: Today Post subject: Pocket GPS Advertising
We see you’re using an ad-blocker. We’re fine with that and won’t stop you visiting the site.
Have you considered making a donation towards website running costs?. Or you could disable your ad-blocker for this site. We think you’ll find our adverts are not overbearing!
All times are GMT + 1 Hour Goto page 1, 2, 3 ... 58, 59, 60Next
Page 1 of 60
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
Or you could disable your ad-blocker for this site. We think you’ll find our adverts are not overbearing!
Hi! We see you’re using an ad-blocker. We’re fine with that and won’t stop you visiting the site.
But as we’re losing ad-revenue from this then why not make a donation towards website running costs?. Or you could disable your ad-blocker for this site. We think you’ll find our adverts are not overbearing!
Forum FAQ
Search
Usergroups
Profile
Log in for private messages
Log in
The positive feedback that we have been getting about the PocketGPSWorld.com Speed Camera Database since its launch over 3 years ago has been nothing short of amazing. I'm sure that all our visitors understand the huge amounts of work that we (but mostly Richard Davies) have put into the application and continue to do so each and every month.
