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Every one should read THIS?
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tomthompson
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 10:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I must say that this thread astounded me when I read it . I didnt realise how many people were hypocritical in response to someone raising this topic . All the well bikers do this and bikers do that so they should be targeted is ridiculous , not because it is or isnt true but that all bikers are being tarred with the same brush .

As someone said this is a discussion forum not a we hate whatever forum.

If and I say if the story has some founding in truth then every road user should be frightened and in the hundreds of thousands of miles I have travelled I have never met someone who has not made a mistake on the road wether it be illegal or just a stupid mistake that might have had serious consequences and I do include myself in that.

Perhaps in my dotage I am being over reactionary but my opinion of this forum has gone down so much by the responses that I have read .

In fact I feel slightly ashamed that I have pointed people to this place over the many years that I have watched and joined in.
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PaulB2005
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 10:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the first problem was the thread was started with half a story, copied and pasted from another site and with no context or explanation. Claims about a database were made but not followed up or substantiated.

If one reads the story it appears the database is purely to be used to examine bikers riding habits on roads that have higher death and injury tolls for bikers, so that the routes they use can be prioritised for improvement and safety. The vehicle registration has to be collected to track a vehicles progress. Or at least that's how i interpreted it. Maybe I'm wrong, but there is no evidence of some super database to catch people when they make a simple one off mistake but at attempt to improve biker safety by looking at where they go. If Bikers are being "targeted" it only because that's what the study is interested in.

The "anti biker" comments weren't as bad as they could have been but there was also an element of "why should they be targeting bikers?" from the other side as if some evil Big Brother had descended upon the UK to victimise bikers. Well to me the story makes the purpose of any such database obvious. It's for their own safety. Many, not all, treat the roads as a race track and if they won't see reason then studies have to be made to help improve the roads for them. It's true that some people are put out by the fact that bikers do get away with things when others don't i.e. immunity in SPECS zones etc. I think it also perceived, and to a degree true, that they flout that immunity so if someone stands up and says "Bikers are being unfairly targeted", others are bound to respond with "Yeah, well about time too." But that's what debate is about.

Perhaps as an ex-biker (Yamaha FZR 400 RR ~5 years) i see both sides of the story but the facts had been sensationalised out of proportion and the back lash to "anti biker" claims was probably to be expected. I also feel some of the "anti biker" comments were taken to heart a bit too quickly.

Forums are, by definition, places of discussion. Sometimes they get heated but this is nothing compared to the sort of treatment you can get in other forums. I think it's a good thing and a great reflection of this forum that a debate such as this can be carried out without it descending too far. It could easily have got out of hand. Yes, noses get put out of joint & egos deflated but there's no real harm done. Is there?

Just my 2p...

Edit: Spelling, Clarity & Context
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tomthompson
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 12:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think what upset me so much is the righteous indignation of people towards one section of the motoring world when to be honest what is happening in that story and another on this forums front page is blatant infringements into every section of the motoring society .

But it seems car drivers being prosecuted for texting,eating ,drinking, reading maps ,phoning ,putting macara on ,shaving and generally screwing up as everybody does at some time is more of a no no and upseting for all.

Its the same for all of us on the road , and I speak as an ex rep driver ,ex white van man ,bike rider and sometimes lorry driver

Road safety is important but it starts with each of us whatever we ride /drive

my tuppence but then I am older
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widowmakerv2
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2009 3:16 pm    Post subject: Proof off One law for car drivers and another for bikes. Reply with quote

tomthompson wrote:
I think what upset me so much is the righteous indignation of people towards one section of the motoring world when to be honest what is happening in that story and another on this forums front page is blatant infringements into every section of the motoring society .

But it seems car drivers being prosecuted for texting,eating ,drinking, reading maps ,phoning ,putting macara on ,shaving and generally screwing up as everybody does at some time is more of a no no and upseting for all.

Its the same for all of us on the road , and I speak as an ex rep driver ,ex white van man ,bike rider and sometimes lorry driver

Road safety is important but it starts with each of us whatever we ride /drive

my tuppence but then I am older


140 in a suberu!!!!! and?

A MOTORIST who drove his Subaru Impreza at 140mph on the M6 has been banned for 84 days.

Anthony Philbin, aged 25, was also fined £100.

Philbin was spotted speeding by a uniformed police patrol van in the early hours of December 31 last year.

His 1992 black Subaru was pulled over on the southbound carriageway, just past Keele services.

Yesterday at North Staffordshire Magistrates' Court, Philbin, from Tamworth, admitted speeding.




The court heard that Staffordshire police officers were observing traffic on the motorway when the Subaru passed them at a speed they believed was faster than the limit of 70mph.

Sandra Whitehurst, prosecuting, told the court: "The patrol van followed the car and when it caught up with it, the Subaru slowed dramatically.

"The officers passed it and then it slowed to 70mph and moved into lane one. The officers continued past the Subaru and then the Subaru pulled out and overtook the police car.

"The officers clocked its average miles per hour as 119.5.

"The Suburu continued to accelerate and officers saw it reached a speed of 140mph.

"It maintained that speed for half a mile before it was pulled over by the officers."

Philbin told police that the car's speedometer only went up to 110mph and then stayed there.

He told the officers who stopped him: "My dad told me to drive carefully and look what I've done. I can't believe how stupid I am."

The court heard that Philbin, who works as a fibreglass laminator at Tamworth firm Pure Water Storage, had owned the Subaru for five months.



"I need my licence for my job and without it my employers have told me they will have to let me go.

"I make water storage tanks and part of my job involves me driving on site to fit the tanks.

"There is also no way I could get to work without driving because there is no bus service or nobody to give me a lift.

"I expect to be disqualified because what I did was stupid. I wasn't in any rush. It was an empty, open road.

"My speedo goes up to 110mph and I didn't realise I was doing more than that, even though I know that's no excuse."

Magistrate Barbara Clarke told Philbin: "You were driving at an exceptionally high speed – double the speed limit on the motorway, in temperatures which were freezing.

"You have to be banned after driving at such a high speed."

Les Dyble, traffic management officer for Staffordshire Police, said: "We welcome this conviction. We should make an example of these drivers. Speed kills."


Then there was the biker who was cought at 120mph with son on the back who was jailed ?

And who cares if it was copy and pasted Grow up.
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DennisN
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2009 10:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Proof off One law for car drivers and another for bikes Reply with quote

widowmakerv2 wrote:
And who cares if it was copy and pasted Grow up.
I care for one and I'm already grown up. That lot could have been succinctly presented as....
"A MOTORIST who drove his Subaru Impreza at 140mph on the M6 has been banned for 84 days and fined £100. But the biker got jailed - Not Fair!" (assuming that's what you mean) and saved a lorra lorra space in this thread! Just as your opening post could have done a similar link to the bike magazine article, saving space and acknowledging the source, rather than apparently presenting it as your own original thinking/reporting.
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exportman
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2009 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi

It is interesting that people have different perceptions of speeding depending on their situation.

Last year I attended a "Speed awareness course" I had been flashed doing 38 in a 30 zone driving my car my own fault and I should have know better.

What was interesting was the attitude of some of the other people on the course. I arrived on my motorbike. Everyone else was in 4 wheel vehicles.

I was sat near a guy who had been caught exceeding the national speed limit in a white sprinter van.

During the sort of introduction group discussion he took exception tome and motorcycles as he claimed that his wife had been hit by one whilst she was exiting a side street. It appears that her life was saved as she was driving a Mercedes car. ( that amused me a little) He said, she was not injured but the Biker suffered multiple broken bones. I said that she must not have looked properly before exiting the side street. His response was the bike was speeding they always speed. I said lucky is was not a big white van then. He appeared to think it was OK to speed in a van as it was easy to see.

Car drivers complain about motorcycles speeding and yes they do, but so do car drivers, van drivers and on occasions HGVs. No one is perfect

Speed gets a bad press "speed kills" but so do a lot of other things. People are killed and maimed in work related accidents. People die in the UK from treatable diseases. I am sure that both of these groups represent greater numbers than are attributable to Road deaths, but not half as easy to demonise someone for.
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widowmakerv2
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 12:37 pm    Post subject: Re: Proof off One law for car drivers and another for bikes Reply with quote

[quote="DennisN"]
widowmakerv2 wrote:
And who cares if it was copy and pasted Grow up.
I care for one and I'm already grown up. That lot could have been succinctly presented as....
"A MOTORIST who drove his Subaru Impreza at 140mph on the M6 has been banned for 84 days and fined £100. But the biker got jailed - Not Fair!" (assuming that's what you mean) and saved a lorra lorra space in this thread! Just as your opening post could have done a similar link to the bike magazine article, saving space and acknowledging the source, rather than apparently presenting it as your own original thinking/reporting.[/quote

Why dont you get a life ? and stop ripping into me if YOU have nothing to ADD then SHUT UP.
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SpikeyMikey
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 3:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think anything that is copied and pasted should be attributed to the original source to give it some credance, and so that others can view the original article in full should it have been shortened in any way.

I don't think your comments to Dennis were warranted, and I for one object to your tone.

In the words of an esteemed film director "Calm down dear" Smile
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widowmakerv2
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 3:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SpikeyMikey wrote:
I think anything that is copied and pasted should be attributed to the original source to give it some credance, and so that others can view the original article in full should it have been shortened in any way.

I don't think your comments to Dennis were warranted, and I for one object to your tone.

In the words of an esteemed film director "Calm down dear" Smile



As i said he had nothing to( add )only to put me down.
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Privateer
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 3:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are good and bad drivers/riders on 2, 4, and more wheels. I'm sure that we all have our pet hates, but can we keep them to ourselves please?

This thread is going seriously Off Topic and more importantly starting to upset people!

Please discuss nicely else this thread will get locked.

Thanks for your understanding.
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Rastech
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PostPosted: Thu May 28, 2009 2:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, as an admittedly 'old fart', old enough to remember the Rights and Liberties we took so much for granted in my younger days, all I can say is things have already gone way too far already.

As someone famous once said (maybe paraphrasing this a bit, as it's from memory) 'If you sacrifice your Liberty in exchange for a promise of Security, you invariably lose both".

Pretty much everything that made this Country worth living in, everything our forebears fought for and even died to protect, has now been brought to an end.

It's too damned sad for words. Crying or Very sad
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